09/28/2001 Sabbath Meeting Transcript


"Holiness: An Introduction"


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WAYne - Shabbat Shalom all :)
WAYne - HalleluYAH!
WAYne - Almighty Father YHWH we come before You in prayer Through Your Righteous Son Yahushua The Messiah!
WAYne - Loving and Merciful ABBA, Thank You for allowing us this day Of rest , to come before You in prayer, praise, worship, learning and fellowship
WAYne - Almighty ABBA YHWH, please forgive us of our short commings, as we try to strive for perfection as Ye are perfect!
WAYne - With You Father anything is possible, so please let Your will be done in our lives
WAYne - Please Father give us indurance and strenght to be set apart as Ye are Set-Apart
WAYne - Thank You for all that we have in life, our daily bread, both the physicle and Spiritual,
WAYne - Help us please our loving El to walk in Your Ways
WAYne - Abba YHWH please give us all the qualities of Love, allow us to be a light always to give Glory to Your Name, to You Almighty Father
WAYne - You are our strong tower, in You we trust Father, May Your Name be Sanctified and Thy Kingdom Come!
WAYne - Almighty One please give the speaker here tonight words of wisdom, Your Words Father
WAYne - and allow us ears to hear and eyes to see
WAYne - Father we ask these things and give you Glory In Your Sons Name, our Hugh Priest and Mediator... Yahushua HaMashiach!
WAYne - So let it be!
WAYne - HalleluYAH!!

EliYah's message:

HalleluYah!!

How appropriate was the prayer of brother WAYne today, that Yahweh's name would be Sanctified, and that we might be set apart/holy and Yahweh is set apart/holy.

Tonight we will begin studying what the scriptures have to say about "holiness/separateness".

This will be the first in a series of studies that will be shared in the coming weeks.

In this study, we will simply be examining the meaning of "holiness/separateness" and looking at what things that Yahweh has declared holy.

The word "Holy" in the Hebrew is from the noun "Qodesh" or the verb "Qadosh". It means "separate, or set apart", nearly always unto Yahweh.

Something that is holy or seperate is something that is not like other common things. It is dedicated, consecrated, devoted and/or separated for Yahweh's special use.

The Brown Driver Briggs Hebrew lexicon has:

8709 sacred, holy -- 1. of [Elohim], as separate, apart, and so sacred, holy: a. exalted on theophanic throne; heavenly throne; in victory. b. separate from human infirmity, impurity, and sin. (page 872)

Some believe that the English word "holy" is not a very good translation, but Webster's Revised Unabridged Dictionary seems to indicate close agreement with the Hebrew:

holy ... 1. Set apart to the service or worship of [Elohim]; hallowed; sacred; reserved from profane or common use; holy vessels; a holy priesthood

Yahweh is very concerned that we know the difference between the holy/separate and the common. He was displeased that the teachers of His Torah (the priests) failed to show the difference between the clean and unclean:

Ezekiel 22:26 - Her priests have violated my law, and have profaned mine holy things: they have put no difference between the holy and profane, neither have they shewed difference between the unclean and the clean, and have hid their eyes from my sabbaths, and I am profaned among them.

The coming priesthood (in the reign of Messiah) will teach the difference:

Ezekiel 44:19 - And when they go forth into the utter court, even into the utter court to the people, they shall put off their garments wherein they ministered, and lay them in the holy chambers, and they shall put on other garments; and they shall not mingle among the people with their garments.

Ezekiel 44:20 - Neither shall they shave their heads, nor suffer their locks to grow long; they shall only poll their heads.

Ezekiel 44:21 - Neither shall any priest drink wine, when they enter into the inner court.

Ezekiel 44:22 - Neither shall they take for their wives a widow, nor her that is put away: but they shall take maidens of the seed of the house of Israel, or a widow that had a priest before.

Ezekiel 44:23 - And they shall teach my people the difference between the holy and profane, and cause them to discern between the unclean and the clean.

So, what is holy and what is profane?

In this study, let's examine who and what is holy. It will not be a complete list, but it is important to get an idea of the things that Yahweh calls holy lest we end up profaning what He has made holy.

The heavens declare (non-stop!) that Yahweh is holy:

Revelation 4:8 - The four living creatures, each having six wings, were full of eyes around and within. And they do not rest day or night, saying: "Holy, holy, holy, YAHWEH El-Shaddai, who was and is and is to come!"

"Kadosh, kadosh, kadosh, Yahweh Tz'vaot. Asher Haya w'howeh w'yawoh!" declares the four living creatures day and night without resting!

Why was it so important for Yahweh's holiness to be declared continuously?

Why is the concept of being 'separate/holy' so important to Yahweh? Let's continue:

Yahweh is holy, and there is no comparison to His holiness:

Exodus 15:11 - Who is like unto thee, O YAHWEH, among the mighty ones? who is like thee, glorious in holiness, fearful in praises, doing wonders?

1Samuel 2:2 - There is none holy as YAHWEH: for there is none beside thee: neither is there any rock like our Elohim.

Psalms 22:3 - But thou art holy, O thou that inhabitest the praises of Israel.

Psalms 103:1 - Bless YAHWEH, O my soul: and all that is within me, bless his holy name.

Yahweh dwells in a holy place:

Isaiah 63:15 - Look down from heaven, and behold from the habitation of thy holiness and of thy glory: where is thy zeal and thy strength, the sounding of thy bowels and of thy mercies toward me? are they restrained?

Deuteronomy 26:15 - Look down from thy holy habitation, from heaven, and bless thy people Israel, and the land which thou hast given us, as thou swarest unto our fathers, a land that floweth with milk and honey.

2Chronicles 30:27 - Then the priests the Levites arose and blessed the people: and their voice was heard, and their prayer came up to his holy dwelling place, even unto heaven.

His name is Holy:

Isaiah 57:15 - For thus saith the high and lofty One that inhabiteth eternity, whose name is Holy; I dwell in the high and holy place, with him also that is of a contrite and humble spirit, to revive the spirit of the humble, and to revive the heart of the contrite ones.

Psalms 33:21 - For our heart shall rejoice in him, because we have trusted in his holy name.

His Spirit is holy:

Psalms 51:11 - Cast me not away from thy presence; and take not thy holy spirit from me.

Isaiah 63:11 - Then he remembered the days of old, Moses, and his people, saying, Where is he that brought them up out of the sea with the shepherd of his flock? where is he that put his holy Spirit within him?

His works are holy:

Psalms 145:17 - YAHWEH is righteous in all his ways, and holy in all his works.

His angels are holy:

Matthew 25:31 - When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:

His arm (Yahushua) is holy:

Psalms 98:1 - O sing unto YAHWEH a new song; for he hath done marvellous things: his right hand, and his holy arm, hath gotten him the victory.

Isaiah 52:10 - YAHWEH hath made bare his holy arm in the eyes of all the nations; and all the ends of the earth shall see the salvation of our Elohim.

Acts 4:27 - For of a truth against thy holy child Yahushua, whom thou hast anointed, both Herod, and Pontius Pilate, with the Gentiles, and the people of Israel, were gathered together,

Hebrews 7:26 - For such a High Priest was fitting for us, who is holy, harmless, undefiled, separate from sinners, and has become higher than the heavens;

Thus, His Word is holy:

Romans 1:1 - Paul, a servant of Yahushua the Messiah, called to be an apostle, separated unto the glad tidings of YAHWEH,

Romans 1:2 - (Which he had promised afore by his prophets in the holy scriptures,)

Romans 1:3 - Concerning his Son Yahushua the Messiah our Saviour, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh;

2Timothy 3:15 - And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Yahushua ha Mashiach.

Romans 7:12 - Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.

The firstborn males are holy to Yahweh:

Luke 2:21 - And when eight days were accomplished for the circumcising of the child, his name was called Yahushua, which was so named of the angel before he was conceived in the womb.

Luke 2:22 - And when the days of her purification according to the law of Moses were accomplished, they brought him to Jerusalem, to present him to YAHWEH;

Luke 2:23 - (As it is written in the law of YAHWEH, Every male that openeth the womb shall be called holy to YAHWEH;)

The Firstfruits of the land is holy to Yahweh:

Ezekiel 48:13 - And over against the border of the priests the Levites shall have five and twenty thousand in length, and ten thousand in breadth: all the length shall be five and twenty thousand, and the breadth ten thousand.

Ezekiel 48:14 - And they shall not sell of it, neither exchange, nor alienate the firstfruits of the land: for it is holy unto YAHWEH.

The year of Jubilee is holy to Yahweh:

Leviticus 25:11 - A jubile shall that fiftieth year be unto you: ye shall not sow, neither reap that which groweth of itself in it, nor gather the grapes in it of thy vine undressed.

Leviticus 25:12 - For it is the jubile; it shall be holy unto you: ye shall eat the increase thereof out of the field.

His promise to Abraham is holy:

Psalms 104:42 -

Psalms 105:42 - For he remembered his holy promise, and Abraham his servant.

Psalms 105:43 - And he brought forth his people with joy, and his chosen with gladness:

Psalms 105:44 - And gave them the lands of the heathen: and they inherited the labour of the people;

Yahweh swears by His only holiness

Psalms 89:35 - Once have I sworn by my holiness that I will not lie unto David.

Psalms 89:36 - His seed shall endure forever, and his throne as the sun before me.

Amos 4:2 - The Sovereign YAHWEH hath sworn by his holiness, that, lo, the days shall come upon you, that he will take you away with hooks, and your posterity with fishhooks.

Amos 4:3 - And ye shall go out at the breaches, every cow at that which is before her; and ye shall cast them into the palace, saith YAHWEH.

His mountain is holy:

Jeremiah 31:23 - Thus saith YAHWEH of hosts, the Elohim of Israel; As yet they shall use this speech in the land of Judah and in the cities thereof, when I shall bring again their captivity; YAHWEH bless thee, O habitation of justice, and mountain of holiness.

Obadiah 1:15 - For the day of YAHWEH is near upon all the heathen: as thou hast done, it shall be done unto thee: thy reward shall return upon thine own head.

Obadiah 1:16 - For as ye have drunk upon my holy mountain, so shall all the heathen drink continually, yea, they shall drink, and they shall swallow down, and they shall be as though they had not been.

Obadiah 1:17 - But upon mount Zion shall be deliverance, and there shall be holiness; and the house of Jacob shall possess their possessions.

Psalms 2:6 - Yet have I set my king upon my holy hill of Zion.

His heavens are holy:

Psalms 20:6 - Now know I that YAHWEH saveth his anointed; he will hear him from his holy heaven with the saving strength of his right hand.

His Temple is holy:

Psalms 5:7 - But as for me, I will come into thy house in the multitude of thy mercy: and in thy fear will I worship toward thy holy temple.

The items of His temple and tabernacle are holy:

Zechariah 14:21 - Yea, every pot in Jerusalem and in Judah shall be holiness unto YAHWEH of hosts: and all they that sacrifice shall come and take of them, and seethe therein: and in that day there shall be no more the Canaanite in the house of YAHWEH of hosts. .

His Sabbath is holy:

Exodus 16:23 - And he said unto them, This is that which YAHWEH hath said, To morrow is the rest of the holy sabbath unto YAHWEH: bake that which ye will bake to day, and seethe that ye will seethe; and that which remaineth over lay up for you to be kept until the morning.

His priesthood is holy:

Leviticus 21:6 - They shall be holy unto their Elohim, and not profane the name of their Elohim: for the offerings of YAHWEH made by fire, and the bread of their Elohim, they do offer: therefore they shall be holy.

His covenant, His apostles and His prophets are holy:

Luke 1:68 - Blessed be YAHWEH Elohim of Israel; for he hath visited and redeemed his people,

Luke 1:69 - And hath raised up an horn of salvation for us in the house of his servant David;

Luke 1:70 - As he spake by the mouth of his holy prophets, which have been since the world began:

Revelation 18:20 - "Rejoice over her, O heaven, and you holy apostles and prophets, for YAHWEH has avenged you on her!"

Luke 1:71 - That we should be saved from our enemies, and from the hand of all that hate us;

Luke 1:72 - To perform the mercy promised to our fathers, and to remember his holy covenant;

The coming New Jerusalem will be holy:

Revelation 21:10 - And he carried me away in the Spirit to a great and high mountain, and showed me the great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from YAHWEH,

Therefore, nothing defiled will enter therein:

Revelation 21:27 - But there shall by no means enter it anything that defiles, or causes an abomination or a lie, but only those who are written in the Lamb's Book of Life.

Brothers and sisters, WE are to be holy:

Leviticus 11:44 - For I am YAHWEH your Elohim: ye shall therefore sanctify yourselves, and ye shall be holy; for I am holy: neither shall ye defile yourselves with any manner of creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

Leviticus 11:45 - For I am YAHWEH that bringeth you up out of the land of Egypt, to be your Elohim: ye shall therefore be holy, for I am holy.

Leviticus 19:2 - Speak unto all the congregation of the children of Israel, and say unto them, Ye shall be holy: for I YAHWEH your Elohim am holy.

Leviticus 20:7 - Sanctify yourselves therefore, and be ye holy: for I am YAHWEH your Elohim.

Leviticus 20:26 - And ye shall be holy unto me: for I YAHWEH am holy, and have severed you from other people, that ye should be mine.

Numbers 15:38 - Speak unto the children of Israel, and bid them that they make them fringes in the borders of their garments throughout their generations, and that they put upon the fringe of the borders a ribband of blue:

Numbers 15:39 - And it shall be unto you for a fringe, that ye may look upon it, and remember all the commandments of YAHWEH, and do them; and that ye seek not after your own heart and your own eyes, after which ye use to go a whoring:

Numbers 15:40 - That ye may remember, and do all my commandments, and be holy unto your Elohim.

Numbers 15:41 - I am YAHWEH your Elohim, which brought you out of the land of Egypt, to be your Elohim: I am YAHWEH your Elohim.

Exodus 19:6 - And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel.

Deuteronomy 14:2 - For thou art an holy people unto YAHWEH thy Elohim, and YAHWEH hath chosen thee to be a peculiar people unto himself, above all the nations that are upon the earth.

Ephesians 1:4 - just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before Him in love,

Ephesians 5:25 - Husbands, love your wives, just as the Messiah also loved the assemblyand gave Himself for her,

Ephesians 5:26 - that He might sanctify and cleanse her with the washing of water by the word,

Ephesians 5:27 - that He might present her to Himself a glorious church, not having spot or wrinkle or any such thing, but that she should be holy and without blemish.

Colossians 3:12 - Put on therefore, as the elect of YAHWEH, holy and beloved, bowels of mercies, kindness, humbleness of mind, meekness, longsuffering;

1Thessalonians 4:7 - For YAHWEH hath not called us unto uncleanness, but unto holiness.

1Thessalonians 5:27 - I charge you by the Master that this epistle be read unto all the holy brethren.

1Peter 1:15 - but as He who called you is holy, you also be holy in all your conduct,

1Peter 1:16 - because it is written, "Be holy, for I am holy."

1Peter 2:9 - But you are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, His own special people, that you may proclaim the praises of Him who called you out of darkness into His marvelous light;

How many times we see in the scriptures, Yahweh's desire for us to be holy!

It is these commands to be holy that we will be focusing on in the coming weeks

We will be examining how to keep ourselves holy, how to keep Yahweh's name holy, and how to keep His Sabbath holy.

Brethren, we are called to be separate!

We must be different, not like the world.

For Yahweh, the one we serve, is holy.

May Yahweh open our hears to hear His word, that we might truly be a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that we should shew forth the praises of him who has called us out of darkness into his marvellous light.

And may Yahweh bless you all !

End


Wayne_Julie - Praise Ye YHWH!
CHILDOFYA - PRAISE YAHWEH
YahismyEL - HalleluYah! Thanks be to Yahweh EL Shaddi the Holy One of Israel!
Jozef_Lydia - Praise Yahweh for teaching us Holiness,may we receive the help of the Holy Spirit to lead us into Holiness
Ruth - \o/\o/\o/ Praise Yahweh \o/\o/\o/
downlo - HalleluYAH!! Beautiful lessons from Father! \0/
pjr - Praise Yahweh
Angel - HalleluYah! \o/
Miles_of_PA - \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ - HALLELUYAH - \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/
CHILDOFYA - OUR MECRCIFUL FATHER
Talmid - Praise YH, an enlightening message for me, most assuredly.
Thor - halleluYAH!
kolayah - :o)
Thor - shabbat shalom kolayah :-)
Angel - Shalom!
Ruth - Great scripture verses to remember, good message
Jozef_Lydia - question: would it be right to conclude that we are part of what Peter said: 1Peter 2:9 - But you are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, His own special people,
EliYah - If we are His
EliYah - Yes
Angel - we are but if we sin, He rejects us!
Jozef_Lydia - if the sin is willfully Angel, otherwise ( If we repent) we have an advocate
Thor - :-)
Yochana - :)
EliYah - If we sin, we need to confess it and forsake it
Ruth - :-)
Talmid - No such thing as neccessary sin.
Angel - yes if we repent heartedly, not like Saul who cried and look for repentance and did not find it, because Yahweh had rejected him.
Jozef_Lydia - Poor saul had no advocate left
EliYah - It seems that Saul repented for his pride's sake
Jozef_Lydia - he must have been an stifnecked ruler
CHILDOFYA - lets not look to the bad things lets look to the Mashiyach
Angel - even with Yahshua, He has said that He will not forgive forever if we keep on using His blood unworthyly.
EliYah - 1Samuel 15:30 - Then he said, I have sinned: yet honour me now, I pray thee, before the elders of my people, and before Israel, and turn again with me, that I may worship YAHWEH thy Elohim.
Yochana - Talmid ~ aren't there situations in the Bible where YAHWEH advised people to speak things which weren't true?
EliYah - Those things are written as an example for us, that we can learn from it
Jozef_Lydia - in the beginning of the lesson I did get the impressin that holiness was equivalent with things unseen.
CHILDOFYA - yes
Yochana - In what way, Eliyah?
Jozef_Lydia - Like Yahweh being Holy ( Inseen)
CHILDOFYA - most certianly they are EliYah
Jozef_Lydia - His people being Holy ( unseen)
Ruth - things unseen?
EliYah - 1Corinthians 10:11 - Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come.
matt - helllo all
Jozef_Lydia - if set appart, it often means hidden
Thor - shalom matt :-)
EliYah - 1Corinthians 10:12 - Wherefore let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall.
Angel - shalom matt
EliYah - They are for our admonitionn
CHILDOFYA - Ilooking behind we can look forward
Jozef_Lydia - Shalom Matt
YahismyEL - Shalom matt
Yochana - I'm sorry, but I don't understand
CHILDOFYA - an look to the tree
CHILDOFYA - of salvation
Yochana - There were situations where YAHWEH told people to say things which were not true, and those people were blessed for obeying him
CHILDOFYA - ?
EliYah - When we see the results of sin in other's lives (such as King Saul), it teaches us not to follow that example
EliYah - Such as?
Yochana - I understand that, Eliyah
Yochana - I'm just trying to remember her name ~ the woman who helped the spies
CHILDOFYA - pride is one of the seven abominations to Yahweh such as the case with Saul
Yochana - She told those who were looking for the spies that they had left, when they hadn't
Yochana - Or something along those lines
Yochana - Rahab? I think that might be her name
Angel - Yochana, Yahweh did not ask her to lie, the israelite spies ask her to hide them
Jozef_Lydia - Jericho, yes that saved the lives of the spies.
Yochana - But YAHWEH blessed her
Yochana - Does that not show that there are things which might normally be considered sin, but in certain situations are not sin in YAHWEH's sight?
EliYah - Joshua 2:4 - And the woman took the two men, and hid them, and said thus, There came men unto me, but I wist not whence they were:
matt - my freinde i am in need of some advice could anyone spare a moment to help a struggling brother in need?
Talmid - He also blessed Jacob no?
EliYah - NKJ Joshua 2:4 Then the woman took the two men and hid them. So she said, "Yes, the men came to me, but I did not know where they were from.
Angel - that was not a sin at all
Jozef_Lydia - so in case of an enemy, and lying to save lives, in her case ( being a non Israelite) she was rewarded with her life
Russ - Fire away matt
YahismyEL - talk matt
EliYah - I have matt in private chat
YahismyEL - ok
Russ - cool
Jozef_Lydia - Like during the WWII, people were hiding Jews, and lied in order to save them, would that have been wrong, or a righteous act?
Angel - righteous act
CHILDOFYA - the diciples hid Saul (paul)
Angel - that was not really liying though it has another name :)
YahismyEL - Would any of us turn another brother in to an enemy?
Jozef_Lydia - I would like to think so too, Angel. :)
Yochana - Yes, but my point is that according to His Word, they did lie, and lying is sin
Yochana - So surely that means that there are times when sin IS necessary?
Angel - lying is something that will hurt someone baddly
Russ - They successfully decieved the enemy
Yochana - Such as in those situations
Yochana - Yes, and I'm certainly not saying that what they did was wrong ~ they did the right thing
Angel - Even Yahshua spoke to that effect when He taught 'Be wise as the serpent and harmless as doves"
Ruth - !rm
Thor - his word is LOVE so helping a brother is LOVE not lie
Jozef_Lydia - true Yochana, but life has precendence over a "untruth" spoken to an enemy
Yochana - Oh, okay
Jozef_Lydia - it does seem to be a contradiction in terms
Yochana - I hope you don't think I'm trying to be difficult :)
Jozef_Lydia - an inigma
CHILDOFYA - but we need to pray ofr the dicernment of that fine line and not be presumptuos
Yochana - I just want to learn
Jozef_Lydia - NO NO.. hey that is what we do here all the time
Miles_of_PA - There is a different standard for the wicked, but from YHWH's point of view it is the same standard.
EliYah - I think, if she prayed about it.. Yahweh could have made a way for her not to lie
Angel - when Yahshua said we should be like the serpent He meant to lie somethimes to defend ourselfs and others who are innocent.
Miles_of_PA - ?
Miles_of_PA - !
Angel - at one time, Yahshua was asked by his brothers
Angel - are you going to the feast
Angel - and He said, not yet and later on He went to protect His life
CHILDOFYA - most certainly Jacob lied to Isaac but still became the inheiter of the covanent to Abramham
EliYah - Actually, Yahushua didn't lie
Angel - these cases are not called lies though
Jozef_Lydia - Rahab was a Canaanite, a non believer. Even a people dispised by Yahweh, on top of that she was a harlot. Yet her act of hiding was counted righteous
Jozef_Lydia - and she became one of the people of Israel
Yochana - Angel ~ what are they called?
Angel - this is being wise as the serpent, just as Yahshua said, so it acctually is being WISE
Angel - WISE
Jozef_Lydia - This shows the Mercy of Yahweh
pjr - Yahweh bless you all though the blood of Yahshua good night
Jozef_Lydia - HalleluYah, if our sin was as red as scarlet, It can we washed away in the blood of the Lamb.
YahismyEL - Ananias and Sephira lied to the Holy Spirit and died.
Yochana - I guess I kinda need to know that He does extend me His Mercy, even in the place I am at now
choosena1 - richie_mac
CHILDOFYA - Yahweh would have provided a way but Jacob way but he did what we all have done and went ahead of the plans of Yahweh
CHILDOFYA - lie
CHILDOFYA - no
YahismyEL - +acts 5 1 2
CHILDOFYA - I dont think so
YahismyEL - +acts 5 3 4
Jozef_Lydia - Yes YahismyEl, it does make a different the WHO one is lying huh :)
YahismyEL - +acts 5 5 6
YahismyEL - +acts 5 7 8
YahismyEL - +acts 5 9 10
Angel - yes we must not lie to the HOLY SPIRIT!
Jozef_Lydia - to lie to an enemy of Yahweh, or to lie to the Holy Spirit.
YahismyEL - I would lie to an enemy
choosena1 - Are we using scripture to excuse lying?
Jozef_Lydia - Me to, if that would mean it would save a life of a brother.
Angel - CHOOSENA1 that means you would cover up a muslin who comes to kill us!
Jozef_Lydia - or sister
YahismyEL - right on Jozef
YahismyEL - Wow!
Jozef_Lydia - But, it does indeed not mean we can be excused for lying in general.
Russ - choosena1, to change nickname: /nick richie_mac
choosena1 - There's a scriptural example of two evils, and the righteous choosing the lesser of two evils. Lying is evil, allowing a brother to be killed by an enemy when you can save him is evil. I'd choose the lesser evil.
Yochana - That makes sense, choosena!
YahismyEL - We have to remember a little leaven leavens the whole lump.
Jozef_Lydia - we should indeed stife to speak the truth at all time, and even in extreme cases pray for what to say.
choosena1 - saving a brother's life is not leaven. G_d says it's greater love to sacrifice ourselves to save another.
Thor - 1kin 22:20-22
Thor - +1kin 22:20-22
Angel - It is a wonder, it has been said: BROTHERS WILL TURN AND BETRAY THEIR BRETHREN!
Miles_of_PA - Pray that one does not learn to lie like a pro.
Jozef_Lydia - or a con

Prayer Service Witheld..

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