EliYah Praise YAHWEH !!
[21:47] Yahcanan Praise his Holy Name!
[21:47] Qumran_Bet Hallelu-Yah!
[21:48] SimCHa Shalom brethren
[21:49] Qumran_Bet Qumran Bet is a Sacred Name Community currently
made up of 3 members: Br.
Jerry, Sis. Juanita, and Br. Clif
EliYah Glad you could all make it and I am pleased (And blessed)
to be among the Qumran Bet
brethren this evening ! :)
EliYah I suppose that we should begin our opening prayer if Brother
Clif would like to
[21:50] Qumran_Bet We are pleased to have him and his family here
with us.
[21:50] Qumran_Bet Yes.
[21:50] Qumran_Bet Dear Heavenly Father YHWH...
[21:51] Qumran_Bet We are grateful to you that we are able to meet
together here as believers in You
and Your Son, YaHUshua the Anointed One...
[21:51] Qumran_Bet We enjoy the fellowship of the keddoshim/saints/holy
ones...
[21:51] Qumran_Bet It is like a healing and comforting salve to
be together with those of like beliefs
and convictions...
[21:52] Qumran_Bet We are desirous that others who are not yet aware
of the truths of the kingdom
may also come into the blessings you have bequeated unto us.
[21:53] Qumran_Bet We pray that you would let your Ruach be here
and anoint this meeting tonight.
[21:53] Qumran_Bet We praise you for making it possible.
[21:53] *** SaintJEB (jeb@rcm-as8s46.erols.com) has joined #1messiah
[21:53] *** `Watchman sets mode: +v SaintJEB
[21:53] Qumran_Bet Please forgive us our sins against our brothers,
and help us to forgive those who
sin against us.
[21:53] Qumran_Bet In the Name of Your Son, YaHushua...
[21:53] Qumran_Bet Ahmeyn. So let it be.
EliYah So let it be, HalleluYah! :)
[21:54] Yahcanan Amen
[21:54] *** EliYah changes topic to "Sabbath meeting in progress ...."
[21:54] SimCHa Hallelu et Adonai!!!
EliYah This evening I would like to talk about a subject that is
very relevant to today especially
EliYah I would like to talk about Modesty and Dress among the brethren
EliYah There is much lust and adultery in today's culture.
EliYah Why is this? Have we just all of a sudden after 200 years
of decent Marriages and rather moral
thinking just decided to be immoral?
EliYah How different are things in today's cultures as compared
to the sexually moral culture that
existed only 100 years ago?
EliYah I believe that one of the major differences is in how the
way we dress.
EliYah At that time it was considered immoral for a woman to even
show her wrists!
EliYah Today, due to the influences in Hollywood among other things,
it is only considered immoral
for a woman to show certain private parts of her body
EliYah How far we have come! It is difficult for those of us growing
up in this culture to understand
what is so immoral about a woman showing her wrists.
EliYah Our minds have been desensitized by all the immodesty out
there
EliYah So what is the standard?
EliYah Where can we look for a standard on what is modest and what
is not?
EliYah The word of Yahweh is the standard. What He thinks is what
really matters.
EliYah So lets find what He says about what is modest:
EliYah +1tim 2 8
[21:59] `Watchman 1Timothy 2:8 - I will therefore that men pray
every where, lifting up holy hands,
without wrath and doubting.
EliYah +1tim 2 9
[21:59] `Watchman 1Timothy 2:9 - In like manner also, that women
adorn themselves in modest
apparel, with shamefacedness and sobriety; not with broided hair, or gold,
or pearls, or costly array;
EliYah So what we see here is truly a definition of modesty. Let's
break down this scripture and study
it in depth.
EliYah 9- In like manner also, that women adorn themselves in modest
apparel,.....
EliYah Yahweh wants us women to adorn ourselves in modest apparel.
Why?
EliYah I belive that one reason is to avoid being a temptation and
a distraction to men.
[22:01] Qumran_Bet (Br. Eliyah is not a woman)
EliYah (I meant though that I am a man, not us women ) hehe
EliYah But This is especially important in today's culture where
lust truly abounds.
EliYah If women are dressed modestly, then men have nothing to see
to be lusting after. Thereby
hindering sin.
EliYah (though some men are so wicked that this may not matter)
EliYah If women wear apparel that attracts men, then it would be
causing men to lust after them.
EliYah Thereby making that woman an agent for sin
EliYah (Though the guilt is primarily on that mans shoulders)
EliYah Continuing...
EliYah 9- ...with reverence and sobriety;
EliYah So not only should a woman be modest, but be modest with
reverence and sobriety. What do
Reverence and sobriety mean?
EliYah The Thayers greek Lexicon says..
EliYah 127 aidos {ahee-doce'} perhaps from 1 (as a negative particle)
and 1492 (through the idea of
downcast eyes); TDNT - 1:169,26; n f AV - shamefacedness 1, reverence 1;
2 1) a sense of shame or
honour, modesty, bashfulness, reverence, regard for others, respect
EliYah Reverence comes from this Greek word meaning Humility or
a sense of shame or honor. This is
part of that Gentle and Quiet Spirit that Yahweh so loves.
EliYah 4997 sophrosune {so-fros-oo'-nay} from 4998; TDNT - 7:1097,1150;
n f 1) soundness of
mind 2) self-control, sobriety
EliYah Sobriety comes from this greek word meaning a controlled
self and a sound mind.
EliYah So not only should a woman be modest in her apparel but also
in that modesty have a humble
and controlled spirit about her.
EliYah Now let's look at what defines immodesty in Yahweh's eyes:
EliYah 9- ... not with braided hair, or gold, or pearls, or costly
array;
EliYah Here is a good definition of the types of things that are
immodest in Yahweh's eyes.
EliYah BRAIDED HAIR:
EliYah Braided meaning woven or weaved. As a basket is woven.
EliYah This is
EliYah not Modest in Yahweh's eyes even though it seems so insignificant
in our current culture.
EliYah What about curling or perming our hair? Perhaps these are
recent inventions just in the last 60
years or so.
EliYah I don't think there were many curling irons back then.?
EliYah So women braided their hair instead. I think women who curl
their hair because "Yahweh said
we shouldn't braid our hair but he never said not to curl it" are
trying to find loopholes in Yahweh's word
EliYah I think they may not understanding the spirit of what Yahweh
is saying here.
EliYah We are to bey His word in the newness of the spirit and not
the oldness of the letter. (Rom
7:6)
EliYah bey = obey
EliYah GOLD OR PEARLS:
EliYah Does this mean gold only and not silver?
EliYah Or pearls and not fake pearls?
EliYah Of course not. The spirit of what He is saying is to not
wear expensive looking jewelry.
EliYah OR COSTLY ARRAY
EliYah Yahweh does not want us to be all decked out in expensive
looking clothes.
EliYah +1pet 3 3-4
[22:09] `Watchman 1Peter 3:3 - Do not let your adornment be [merely]
outward--arranging the hair,
wearing gold, or putting on [fine] apparel--
[22:09] `Watchman 1Peter 3:4 - rather [let] [it] [be] the hidden
person of the heart, with the
incorruptible [beauty] of a gentle and quiet spirit, which is very precious
in the sight of YAHWEH.
EliYah Some have said that this is what Paul meant in the previous
verses. But Paul is only reiterating
the fact that what is important isn't the outside, but the inside. Nowhere
in this verse is it said that it is
ok to wear these things.
EliYah Being a person of Yahweh, we as men also would want to avoid
being immodest
EliYah But primarily, men are attracted by looks....
EliYah And women by emotions and personalities
EliYah Nevertheless, modesty is important for all people of Yahweh
EliYah And I believe that these verses perhaps only scratch the
surface..
EliYah But they are a good indicator and a shining light in this
world of darkness and sex driven
mentality
EliYah May Yahweh bless you all, thank you :)
[22:13] Qumran_Bet Thank you so much.
[22:13] Qumran_Bet --Br. Jerry
EliYah Praise Yahweh! :)
EliYah Any comments or questions?
[22:13] Qumran_Bet Yes. --Br. Jerry
[22:13] Qumran_Bet Yes...
[22:14] Qumran_Bet I've been studying a little about the men's manner
of dress, when they are
worshippers of YHWH.
[22:14] SimCHa I have a comment...
[22:14] Yahcanan Excellent message! Praise Yahweh
[22:14] Qumran_Bet This since I found out about a believing woman's
dress...
EliYah one moment Simcha :)
[22:14] SimCHa yep :-)
[22:15] Qumran_Bet See, believers and unbelievers tend to think
that the Bible is disproportionately
heavy on women about the matter of modesty and dress...
[22:15] Qumran_Bet But this is not so...
[22:15] Qumran_Bet Men who are trying to keep the Torah are to wear
tzit-tziyot(tassels) and wear a
beard and sidelocks...
[22:16] Qumran_Bet A beard and sidelocks cover up the face...
[22:16] Qumran_Bet So they are somewhat of an instrument of modesty...
[22:16] Qumran_Bet These are just some things I've seen...
EliYah Interesting :)
EliYah I believe that men should wear a beard
[22:17] SaintJEB Do you?
EliYah And the tassels also
[22:17] Qumran_Bet Yes, Br. Eliyah has a beard, I see. : )
[22:17] SimCHa correct. if a man is trying to live a Torah observent
life then that is what he should do.
[22:17] SaintJEB not trying to sound mean or condisending
[22:17] Qumran_Bet No. I understand St. Jeb.
[22:17] Qumran_Bet : )
[22:17] Qumran_Bet --Br. Clif
EliYah The romans did shave their beards...but this was not so among
the Israelites following the Torah
[22:18] SaintJEB Do you EliYah?
EliYah Yes :)
[22:18] * SaintJEB shakes Eliyah's hand
[22:18] SaintJEB Thankyou for the message
[22:18] Qumran_Bet Nice to meet you, Saint. : )
[22:18] Qumran_Bet --Br. Clif
EliYah Give praise to Abba Yahweh..thank you for being here this
evening :)
[22:19] SimCHa Jesus had a beard, pays(curls on side of head) and
He wore tzitzits (fringes)
[22:19] SaintJEB Nice to meat you too
EliYah Simcha, did you have a comment?
[22:19] SimCHa Shalom SaintheB!
EliYah Yes, He did Simcha!
EliYah +isa 50 6
[22:19] `Watchman Isaiah 50:6 - I gave my back to the smiters, and
my cheeks to them that plucked
off the hair: I hid not my face from shame and spitting.
[22:19] SimCHa yes...as far as the message for us men to be modest...
[22:20] Qumran_Bet And since YaHUshua was not a Nazarite, he probably
had a short haircut, except
for his sidelocks...
EliYah Yes, He couldn't have taken a Nazarite vow due to the fact
that he drank of the vine
[22:21] SimCHa BUT the fact remians that He did not sin, the Torah
was His life and the Torah says
that you must do all these things. So He did. ;)
[22:21] SimCHa ...back to my comment...
[22:21] SimCHa I am a very charming fellow...
[22:22] SimCHa often I act in an immodest way, and often I attract
women through my immodest
behaviour...
[22:23] SimCHa I never realised how serious this is... YHVH really
*hit* me with your message...
Barkhoo l'Adonai!!!
EliYah Praise Yahweh :)
[22:23] SimCHa YHVH yeemlokh l'olam vaed!
[22:23] SimCHa Thank you YVHV!!
[22:23] SimCHa YHVH!
[22:24] SaintJEB (sorry but I don't know hebrew)
[22:24] *** Baruch (~Guess@hawk116.hawkpci.net) has joined #1messiah
[22:24] *** `Watchman sets mode: +v Baruch
[22:24] SimCHa Thank you! Brother EliYah
EliYah Shalom Baruch!
[22:24] Baruch (¯`'·.¸(¯`'·.¸(¯`'·.¸(¯`'·.¸¸.·'´¯)¸.·'´¯)¸.·'´¯)¸.·'´¯)
[22:24] Baruch (¯`'·.¸(¯`'·.¸
ŸŸŸŸŸŸŸŸŸŸŸŸŸ ¸.·'´¯)¸.·'´¯)
[22:24] Baruch . ----==----- EliYah ----==----
[22:24] Baruch (_¸.·'´(_¸.·'´ 0ŸŸŸŸŸŸŸŸŸŸŸŸŸ
`'·.¸_)`'·.¸_)
[22:24] SimCHa The LORD will reign forever!
[22:24] Baruch (_¸.·'´(_¸.·'´(_¸.·'´(_¸.·'´`'·.¸_)`'·.¸_)`'·.¸_)`'·.¸_)
[22:24] Baruch manishma EliYah?
EliYah Shalom, Mah Slomcha?
EliYah (Shlomcha)
[22:25] Baruch tov
EliYah Mitzuyan!
[22:26] SimCHa Shabbat Shalom Baruch!
[22:26] SimCHa TOV!!!!!
[22:26] Baruch shabbat shalom to you too brother simcha
[22:26] SimCHa ani mitzuyan!\
EliYah Long time no see Baruch :)
[22:26] * SimCHa runs to Baruch as *fast* as he can and gives Baruch a
holy SMOOCH!
[22:26] SimCHa Love ya bro!
[22:27] Baruch yzyzyzyzyz SimCHa zyzyzyzyyz
EliYah Unless you are in Texas, Baruch...you can run pretty fast :)
[22:27] Qumran_Bet Yes, it is much easier to institute the holy kiss on
IRC... : )
[22:27] SaintJEB I have a question
EliYah ok :)
[22:27] SimCHa oh, i have no prob doin it in person! ;)
[22:27] Baruch true
[22:28] Baruch me either..
[22:28] SaintJEB Is it using Yahweh's name in vain by saying Father or
God?
[22:28] SimCHa They don't call be Simcha for nothin
[22:28] Qumran_Bet Simcha=kiss?
EliYah I think the term "God" is of Pagan origin....so I avoid
it
* Sound request: can't find [adonai.wav]
* Baruch
[22:29] SimCHa nope..joyous one
[22:29] SimCHa !Baruch adonai.wav
[22:29] Baruch no.. means joy
[22:29] SaintJEB What about Father?
[22:29] SimCHa yep
EliYah But Calling Him "Father" though is always appropriate
:)
[22:29] SaintJEB ok
[22:29] SaintJEB thankyou
[22:29] Qumran_Bet But that is only a title.
[22:29] SaintJEB I have stumbled on to somethign very different tonight
[22:29] SaintJEB I never new Christians could live like this
EliYah Bivakasha (you are welcome :))
[22:30] SaintJEB I always grew up in teh traditional teachings
EliYah Many of us have, Jeb
EliYah But Yahweh is doing a mighty thing in these last days
[22:30] SaintJEB and I talked to Soar`negl and I don't know what to exactly
think
[22:30] *** Qumran_Bet is now known as Soar`negl
[22:31] SaintJEB My name is Joe or Joseph If you wish to call me by my
true name
[22:31] *** Soar`negl is now known as Qumran_Bet
[22:31] SaintJEB ahh
[22:31] *** Baruch has quit IRC (Connection reset by peer)
EliYah I believe that Yahweh is revealing His true ways to those who are
seeking Him
[22:31] Qumran_Bet Yosef in Hebrew. : )
EliYah It is prophesied that knowledge shall increase
[22:32] SaintJEB I wish to be a Pastor, I am only in Highschool
[22:32] *** Baruch (Guess@hawk116.hawkpci.net) has joined #1messiah
[22:32] `Watchman Welcome back to #1MESSIAH Baruch
[22:32] *** `Watchman sets mode: +v Baruch
[22:32] Baruch sorry...
EliYah But we must remember that to whom much is given much is required!
[22:32] Baruch pirch had a illegal operation...
EliYah SaintJeb, I would study the word by the Spirit of Yahweh and beware
of schools of Theology
EliYah And if Yahweh leads you to be a teacher, follow His leading...but
know that teachers will
receive a stricter judgement
[22:33] Qumran_Bet Does anyone have any inside information on the House
of Yahweh in Abilene,
TX as relates to the Feds?
[22:34] SaintJEB What type of Pastoral Schools do you recommend
[22:34] SaintJEB I know
* Baruch
[22:34] SaintJEB I am striving to make my walk narrow
[22:34] * SimCHa is a 24 year old dude from Canada (eh!) who StRIveS to
GrOOVe in HIS SPirIT!
[22:35] SaintJEB What do you think of Christian Music
EliYah SaintJeb, I would avoid all of them and study things out by the
Spirit of Yahweh...The Messiah
never went to no school
[22:35] SaintJEB But then by what means would one became a Pastor
[22:35] SaintJEB I gotta go
[22:36] SaintJEB Yahweh Bless
EliYah We need not be ordained by men
[22:36] SaintJEB Shalom
EliYah ok..
[22:36] Qumran_Bet May YHWH Bless You!
EliYah May He bless you and give you peace and truth....
[22:36] Qumran_Bet ---Br. Clif
[22:36] *** SaintJEB (jeb@rcm-as8s46.erols.com) has left #1messiah
EliYah Well brethren, I think we will close the meeting at this time if
there are no more
questions/comments?
[22:39] SimCHa Who is everyone here?
[22:40] Baruch i have none at this time EliYah :0)
* EliYah is EliYah :)
[22:41] Baruch and you will always be EliYah too.. heehe
EliYah :)
[22:41] * SimCHa is Bryce
[22:41] * SimCHa is a friendly boy
EliYah I think then, we will close with Prayer if Br. Jerry would like
to lead
[22:43] Qumran_Bet Thank you, Father, for giving us this opportunity to
meet together in your Name.
[22:43] Qumran_Bet We ask for guidance, for blessing, for love of the brothers,
as well as love for
those who have proven to be enemies.
[22:44] Qumran_Bet We ask that you give us the kind of insight that allows
us to see your love.
[22:44] Qumran_Bet We ask this in the Name of our Saviour, Y'shua Messiah.
[22:44] Qumran_Bet Amen.
EliYah So let it be, HALLELUYAH! :)
[22:44] SimCHa Ameyn
[22:44] Qumran_Bet Hallelu-Yah!
[22:44] Baruch Ameyn Ameyn
EliYah Thank you brethren :)
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