Re:Truth

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: Dear D'vorah : I WILL ANSWER YOUR POINTS IN A LETTER ABOVE. UNFORTUNATELY, I AM HAVING DIFFICULTY RESPONDING TO SO MANY AT ONCE. : SINCERELY, : JOSEPH : : : : Joseph posted the following article in the WWWBoard : : : : : : Dated : October 29, 1997 at 21:06:09 : : : Subject: Re:Truth : : : : : : Dear D'vorah, : : : You mention "dual fulfillments". One to two sentences taken by themselves does not allow for proper interpretation. You MUST take the whole chapter in context. Read the whole chapter does it at all imply the year 1 of the common era. : : ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ : : Well...if you look at the whole of the chapter you actually see three fulfillments. =) One..in king Ahaz's day, one when YHWSHUA walked here as man and one that is "in that day' , which we know is a Hebraic term for the Yom/Day of YHWH...so there is a third fulfillment concerning the chavlai shel Mashiach/birthpains of Mashiach/the Trib. Per. Yes...by looking at the whole context can give you more than even a dual fulfillment... : : Concerning taking on a few passukim/verses....what about the prophecies concerning the oil that was recently found in Yisrael? Did the whole context speak of the oil? {Hoshea 12:1, Devarim/Deut. 13:13 & 24, Yeshayahu/Isa. 2:7, Bereshit/Gen. 49:25-26} No..but only a few passukim/verses here and there...but those that study Torah knew this was a future fulfillment that has just came to pass...if you would like to see & hear these prophecies and the article go to this url and click on the article about "Oil in Yisrael!" : : http://www.hatikva.org : : ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ : : :According to your logic of taking one or two sentences in isolation and saying there is a deeper hidden meaning which is speaking of the messiah and a virgin birth, I could take Proverbs 30:6 and say without a doubt that this is a warning against the Christian Bible/ New Testament (as I discussed with David previously). At least this interpretation fits nicely in context considering tense, subject matter, speaker etc. : : ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ : : No, you couldn't use this against the B'rit Chadasha because if you did then you would also have to use against the Talmud, Midrash and any commentaries that expounded upon Torah...correct? : : ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ : : : : : : The child was to be called Immanu-el by his mother see Yeshayahu 7:14. : : ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ : : But why then was he called "Maher-Shalal-Hasha-Baz"? {Yeshayahu 8:3} : : ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ : : : The child was to do certain things as a child. None of this is CLEARLY discussed in the Christian Bible. It could have happened, but we don't know, therefore it can not be used as a proof. : : ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ : : What were these 'certain things' the child was suppose to do you are talking about? : : ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ : : : : : : You seem overly confident that there is a dual fulfillment. I think this is because you are compelled to believe this by your other beliefs. : : ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ : : I am confident of the dual {acutally three} prophecy because I have read the prophecy and know that YHWSHUA fulfilled it with His first coming. : : When your Mashiach comes that you are waiting for..you are going to have to measure this person with the prophecies in the Tanakh ...are you not? Then I think you should do this also with YHWSHUA...we have the account of His life in the B'rit Chadashah...please measure Him with the prophecies..you will see that He fulfilled many, many in just His first coming {ben Yosef} and will fulfill the rest in His second coming {ben David}. : : ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ : : :You see, if the word 'bethula' was used, you : : : and others would definitely say, "see, it says 'virgin', it clearly implies the Christian Bible story regarding a virgin birth"(and there are MANY that believe almah =virgin, due to a sloppy translation, that state this). And now that in actuality, the word 'almah' is used, you say, "see, it says 'young maiden' it clearly implies a dual fulfillment." No matter what, you belive this verse MUST be talking about the virgin birth story. : : ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ : : True..because it is talking about the virgin birth of YHWSHUA.....but that is the way of Scriptures, is it not? To have a peshat/literal and a sod/deeper meaning??? That is why YHWH specifically chose the word 'almah'...because it is a dual prophecy....when and if you see that YHWSHUA is HaMashiach you will see that this is true....of all the miracles that YHWH has performed for His people do you think that this would be too difficult? : : What about Sarah bearing a child..Yitzchak...long after her age of bearing had ceased...and the donkey that talked that Bala'am rode? Not to mention many, many other miracles that are almost to glorious to even fathom--parting of Yom Suf/Reed Sea! Our Elohim is just TOO Magnificient to say He couldn't or wouldn't perform a virgin birth! Baruch Hu!/Blessed is He! : : ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ : : : It appears almost an act of desperation. It Must fit. : : : It doesn't, though. Could it be a subtle hint, maybe. A hint that can only be seen by someone who is already a believer and needs to see it. But, definitely no scriptural proof. : : : : : : D'vorah, I truly hope I am not insulting you. My opinion is that you are a very good and religious person. I think very highly of you. However, you must see my point. : : ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ : : Oh no, you are not insulting me at all...and I do see you point. But there has just been entirely too much 'missionaring' among Christians to get Yehudim to believe but in the process telling us that we have to give up our roots and obedience to our Elohim..YHWH...this has caused so much harm in even trying to get Yehudim to look seriously at YHWSHUA being possibly HaMashiach...and it really makes my heart ache for all my brothers that this stumbling block as been put in their way!!! But I am consoled in the thought that many, many will become believers and accept Him at some point in the future! Praise YHWH l'olam va'ed!!!!/forever and ever. : : All I can say Joseph is just have a open mind and heart when you look at all that is being put forth to you concerning YHWHSHUA...if you are truly seeking the Will of YHWH I have no doubt you will find the answer you are looking for. : : Sha'alu Shalom Yerushalayim/Pray for the peace of Jerusalem, : : D'vorah

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