What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU

Posted by: Tamar Deburg

What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 11/12/10 04:22 PM

I'm curious....What does coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU?
Posted by: A_man_of_ELYON

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 11/18/10 01:46 PM

Quote:
What does coming out of Babylon mean?



A person begins to come out of the things that pertain to Babylon when (s)he will know what names, signs and doctrinal images, belonging to the church that has the title ‘Mother’, were mixed in the translations of the bibles; all things that do not pertain to the Torah nor to the books of the Prophets as originally written such as the word ‘baptism’ originated from the Roman terms Vattésimus (battesimu––augury) and Vaticynius (consecration made through augury or prediction); and images of doctrines of faiths and things that belong to the mixed translation and terminology that was left in the bible for the exclusive use of the State of Vatican and the Roman ordinations.


1st. There is only one woman (church; city; congregation) that calls herself by the title Mother which is also written on her forehead. Therefore the great Babylon is not about too many women but one Mother church; city or congregation.

2nd. A gilded cup of wine. On her forehead the title Mother of beliefs and spiritual fornications [type of love dedicated to images of saints] does not reveal who it is unless there is a woman--church which calls herself by the spiritual title Mother, and offers in her rites and masses for the nations a gilded cup full of the belief that the wine she has drunk is transubstantiated into holy blood.

3rd. A Babylonical; great or big in size. Vaticanus hill is one of the seven hills upon which the city of Rome was built; - A woman sitting upon a scarlet force. Symbolism of the flag of the Vatican's army -- the Swiss cross on a red field ultimately derives from a similar banner of the Roman Empire.

Book of Revelations clears up that the scarlet beast itself is the eighth nation, and is of the seven, for being Rome which in the past was the Roman empire. That is the beast that was and is not.

Therefore, literally, there is an eighth nation -State of Vatican— which is of the seven for being of Rome. The scarlet beast; the scarlet force that was (a Roman empire) and is not, lives in the form of reverenced ordination.

½. On the day a person comes out of Babylon then (s)he begins to revert the substitutions that had been made to the translations, knowing that the words 1st. Lord 2nd. god (elohim), 3rd. IESVS, JE-SUS (I-HORSE, Sameq, Vav, Sameq, 60,6,60); 4th. Christus; 5th. cross; 6th. crucify; 7th. baptism, 8th. faith (Roman doctrine of fides quae creditur and belief)

had been placed as substitute words for 1st. YHWH; 2nd. EL (ELYON); 3rd. YHWH’ÓSHUA (I AM WHO ANOINTS) 4th. Anointed, 5th. tree, 6th. suspend, 7th. Unction, 8th. Emunah--fidelitate--fidelity (hearing rather than working up a belief; understand; having ears to hear; give permanence; remain; endure).




Posted by: A_man_of_ELYON

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 12/15/10 02:29 PM

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Parable of the Road -- The light is with you for a brief time. Walk on the road in the time you have the light so that gloom doesn't overtake you. He that walks in the gloom credits a light by believing that a road is there but doesn't know where he's going. In the time you have the light, see the road in the light so that you may become a first-fruit of the light


Quote:
Brief time: Immediate time; A sequence of time that is abbreviated.
Access in a brief or Immediate sequence.
...believing there is a road –– Synonym: Not seeing the road.
Bible in Basic English -- ...one walking in the dark has no knowledge of where he is going.
Roman doctrine fides quae creditur -- ...walks in darkness [in lack of belief] knows not where he goes.




Parable of the Trail – Is there not a half day of daylight? A man may go about a half day without falling because he sees the trail in the light. But if a man goes about in the gloom, believing there is a trail, he may have a fall because the daylight does not depend on his will of believing.


Quote:
Half day: Immediate time; A Mediated sequence of time that is a dividing of time.
...believing there is a trail –– Synonym: Not seeing the trail.
Bible in Basic English -- ...he may have a fall because the light is not in him.
Roman doctrine fides quae creditur -- ...because there is no light [of belief] in him.
And If you feel that you can’t go on --a system of a ‘just believe’,
when you know that you can’t go wrong, in the Light you’ll find the road.



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Posted by: JamesTheMechanic

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 12/17/10 01:13 PM

Absolutely Everything! I'm glad to be free. It means He was faithful who promised to be found by those who diligently seek Him. It means freedom from religion, and back into the battle to spread His Word so that if He calls someone who hears it they can be free also!

It also means the days are short. He's coming soon. He called us out by waking us up. Let's not come out in search of another Babylon. Lets sound the alarm!
Posted by: yonah1

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 12/25/10 06:41 AM

The Messianic Movement

......."The Christian doctrine that Messiah did away with the Law has turned the Bible and biblical faith upside down. All of the ethical and moral instructions and commandments of Scripture are open to debate. If the Law was done away with, then three quarters of the Scriptures are unreliable and useless to Christians.

But clear, independent thinking people are seeing through the lie and seeing the truth of Scripture: Elohim doesn't change and neither does his moral character, his moral teachings and his definition of righteousness. What he gave to his ancient people is still valid and still speaks of his integrity today. None of his requirements and commandments have changed, because God doesn't change.

Consequently, a remnant of believers in Messiah are beginning to see the need for obedience to the commandments of Scripture. This repentance is the repentance spoken of by the prophets. When his people in the last days repent of their transgressions and rebellion against his Torah, and begin to seek Elohim with all their heart and mind, then he will fulfill his promise to bring Messiah and regather his people back to the promised inheritance of Land in Israel.

So Christians are discovering these truths and are no longer being accepted in the Christian churches because they are no longer towing the party or congregational line. They are no longer believing the traditions and practices and teachings of the denomination, because they are repenting of their rejection of the Torah and are beginning to embrace Torah as the proper walk of faith for the true disciples of Messiah.

As Christian ministers and pastors and teachers are confronted with those who are rebelling against the teachings of the church, they are expressing disdain for these "new" beliefs and are making it clear that those who embrace these Hebraic "heresies" are no longer welcome in the fellowship. Its no wonder that so many Christians are disengaging from and leaving their churches.

In my own experience, I long ago saw in the Scriptures that the pretrib rapture teaching was not biblical. As I studied more and more, I became convinced of it and shared it with others who saw the same thing as I did. But when I shared my belief (or non-belief) in the teaching of the pre-trib rapture with my pastor, I came up against a stone wall. I was ultimately told that I was no longer welcome to teach and fellowship with his congregation, because I would not conform and teach their doctrine of pre-trib rapture as truth.

I have heard many similar testimonies from others who were led by the Spirit to be convinced that one or several of the teachings of their church, denomination or pastor, was not biblical. And each one of them was met with the same disdain and rejection as I was. They were either thrust out of the fellowship or they willing moved on away from the fellowship as they began to see the "writing on the wall."

The combination of hypocrisy and sin in the leadership, the pervasiveness of false doctrine, and the hard-headed refusal by church leaders to hear and allow different opinions, beliefs and points of view in biblical interpretation have led thousands and thousands of believers to leave their home churches, and eventually to abandon all Christian churches as the place of worship and fellowship. Without a community church at which these truth seekers are welcome, there is really no other option but to worship and study at home and seek out others who feel the same way! And this is precisely what the Holy Spirit is leading many to do.

The rise in popularity of home Bible study groups is well known. Even within the larger Christian churches, home study groups have gained in popularity as a way of promoting fellowship and intimacy among believers and stimulating personal Bible study. Yet those who have left the church make the home fellowship into their singular mode of worship and study. It is in this context that more profound changes can take place. Without being under the control and supervision of a church, a pastor, an elder body or a doctrinal creed, truth seekers are able to explore Bible subjects freely without fear of censorship or scorn from those looking over their shoulders.

The Embracing of Torah

It is within this freedom of independence from an authoritative man made structure (a church) that people can truly contemplate ideas of Biblical interpretation which institutional organizations have labeled as "heretic" or "unorthodox." In this context, truth seekers may study doctrines and teachings from the Bible which had previously been frowned upon by their pastor or teacher.

At the top of the list of the many doctrines and teachings which have been summarily dismissed in the past, is that of the Law of Moses. In nearly every sect, denomination and church, the thought that Jesus did away with the Law is pervasive. This is a foundational assumption in Christian doctrine. So it affects all other doctrines and beliefs in Christianity.

But upon open investigation of this question, and without the constraints of church tradition to mute these inquiries, truth seekers are quickly rediscovering that the Torah is not only still valid as the expression of Elohim's will for his people, but the Torah contains a whole world of common sense instructions about how to live the "Christian life."

Messiah Yahusha has made it very easy to understand his position on Torah. In the Sermon on the Mount, Yahusha exclaimed,

"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven." (Matthew 5:17-19)

Away from the influences of Christian dogmas and forced interpretations, this plain statement clearly states that Messiah is not abolishing Torah. Quit simply, he has come to reveal its true meaning (fulfill it). Moreover, those who are the greatest in the kingdom are those who obey Torah and teach Torah. And those who transgress Torah and teach others to transgress Torah are the least of all who make it to the kingdom of heaven.

Truth seeking Messianics who realize this simple fact and its ramifications for the life of faith must dramatically change many things in their lives, because much of what Christians believe and do are contrary to the written Torah of Scripture. Accordingly, most Messianic home fellowships and Messianic congregations begin following a regular reading schedule of the five books of Moses called the Torah or "Law."

Even the New Testament elders, in that well known "Jerusalem Counsel" which convened over the debate of what should be required of new gentile converts to the Messianic faith, concluded that only a few essential laws should be required:

"It is my judgment, therefore, that we should not make it difficult for the Gentiles who are turning to Elohim. Instead we should write to them, telling them to abstain from food polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from the meat of strangled animals and from blood." (Acts 15:19-20)

The justification for only requiring these few laws of Gentiles follows:

"For Mosheh has been preached in every city from the earliest times and is read in the synagogues on every Sabbath." (Acts 15:21)

The meaning of this statement should not be underestimated. The new Messianic believers would no doubt assemble with the others on every Sabbath day. On every Sabbath day, the biblical custom is to read a portion of the Torah and "midrash" over it - that is to say, the elders would explain its meaning and application to the assembly........"


http://www.bibletruth.cc/Body_Messianic.htm
Posted by: A_man_of_ELYON

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 01/18/11 12:25 PM

Originally Posted By: JamesTheMechanic
I'm glad to be free.

..It means freedom from religion, and back into the battle..

..someone who hears it they can be free also!

..It also means the days are short.
Let's not come out in search of another Babylon. Lets sound the alarm!


And freedom from religion also means freedom from the image of the leopard; the image of doctrine that was consecrated in the bibles by the ordination (of words) from versio vulgata, which was left to the eighth kingdom (State of Vatican),


Quoting from a work entitled THE REVERSED WRITINGS,


The one who knows the heart does not need to trust or believe


From a book of 150 chapters a sentence is picked, '..bossom friend in whom I trusted who ate of my bread..', and then an ordinance of Litanies, also named Sacred Vulgate, does propose that the lamb would have been a spirit of man; a second person; god-the son, because, according to the ordinance, the lamb would have to be seen as one who believes and trusts, precisely the averse of the living Word that knows the heart and the thoughts.


A brief return to the facts that might be seen from the connection between the testimony in the first pages of Acts of Pilate (Gospel of Nicodemus) – Hebrew Names Edition –, and all fragments of texts in the books of the ancient ones in reference to the Word that was in the beginning.


In a written testament the words are given to be heard after the death of whom declared them. The reverse of it is a covenant through living Word declared in Immediate time; without interruption of time neither before nor after the resurrection of the lamb. When seeing which fragments of texts in the bible do not pertain to the Song of the Lamb (The Gospels and the writings of the apostles as originally written) nor to the Song of Mosheh (all words written by Mosheh and the books of the Prophets as originally written); one ascertains that there are two different transcriptions on how the lamb came in the presence of Pilate:

Gospel of Nicodemus––Acts of Pilate, treats the lamb as the living יהוה Word that was made flesh and became one of us just physically. Your word is a little part of you, and if your word is of a realm over Heavens and beyond then the word you declare shines white Light and come into being and say I AM THE LIGHT; And your own word is made flesh; with ability to walk and speak without taking a second person, vessel or prophet to do it for you. Being completeness of the Word that initiates the times and makes all things new, the Word [יהוה] of Yhwh was made flesh; not a spirit of man nor a second person either.

The second transcription, named passion of christ, staples the lamb to the spirit of a second person or spirit of man that was made flesh; Because the ordinance of Litanies, which speaks through the texts, calls the lamb a son of man, son of Adam, god-the son or the god in the person of the son; And it does not treat the lamb as the living יהוהWord in real time and not with ink, writing with life and new actions the covenant of Whom makes all things new. To the contrary, treats the living Word as having been put in subjection under words that were written about David or a spirit of man, whenever that ordinance says: '…that the scripture might be fulfilled'.



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Posted by: A_man_of_ELYON

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 01/20/11 01:28 PM


In the book of IsaYah the same Word clears up, I AM the same; I AM the first (the one that begets), I AM also the last (the one that is begotten).

From all words in the Sefer Tehilim (book of Psalms) and in the books of the Prophets, only what was written in reference to the living Word [יהוה] of the Celestial is that which can be quoted for testimony of the fulfillness of prophecy about the living Word that became flesh,

These are the words which I spoke to you beforehand
that it was important that all things which are fulfilled in Me are those written about Me
– (the Word יהוה that was in the beginning)
in the books of the Law, of the Psalms and of the Prophets.

Text originated from versio vulgata: ‘...that all things must needs be fulfilled, which are written...’


The sending of the Truth that sanctifies does not depend on asking or praying

When you establish your house to be built upon the truth that sanctifies and be complete and ready to shelter whom you want the most then you send all materials for your house including the coating and ornaments. The last thing you need is a second person asking or praying for you to still send or do one thing or another since that would make it sound as if you needed to be reminded, as if it was not clearly understood that I AM already knows what you need.

When one is prudent as (when dealing with) serpents, in regards to badly revised copies of bibles then (s)he will see the field in the light and ascertain whether the alleged prayer of Iesus for his disciples would have ever taken place.

Text originated from versio vulgata: '...Sanctify them in the truth, your word is the truth...'

The living Word that was in the beginning said: I AM the Truth.

And only the averse - of the Completeness of I AM THE LIGHT – would need to pray and speak as if the Truth itself, the Word of Yhwh, was not there at that moment, present in the flesh.


Non-existence of Judas story in the earliest documents

In the Gospels of Mark and Luke, it is stated that following the resurrection the lamb appeared to the eleven. Who was not present? –– Book of John clears up that the one missing was Tomah (Thomas), therefore the eleven had to include Judah (Judas).

When Paul writes to the people of Corinto (1 Cor **:*) that after his resurrection the lamb was seen by the twelve, this had to include Judah since it was only after the ascension, approximately forty days after the resurrection (Acts *:*), that another person would have been voted in to replace Judah.

However, if in real life, an election of apostle requires the work of casting lots to help with decision making: It is indirect vote and a system opposite to the one that the twelve apostles were elected, when the Word alone is that chooses, and chooses when the Word is pronounced.

When a story is proper to whoever has a need to give credit, and where salvation would depend upon him working up a belief credited by the spirits of men; Is that not a story where the Word is shown as absent or unable to speak, so that decision making would depend upon lots being cast by the man? Much more disgraced and absent is a word or spirit that takes a prayer to have that casting of lots done well.


The emerging of the passion of christ

The living Word always comes first and only then comes the word in written form. However that is not what takes place in the following sentence: ‘…(would have to betray him) that the scripture might be fulfilled’.

What does determine which of the 150 chapters of the book of Psalms might be sheltering 1 or 2 verses that needs to be fulfilled; the need of using ancient scripture so that it might fulfill (give legitimacy) to a believed story, to show it as authentic scripture, and to fill out a lamb made by order, proper for the usage of the tradings of religion and doctrines.

And all that requires these three things: the god, or the generic term elohim--god(s), the worshipping and prayer rituals, and the need to give (spiritual) credit to become a creditor of merit, does also require a lamb in the same measure: a lamb that would need to be betrayed and delivered by an armed escort so that he should deliver his life.


Disconnection between the Word of Yhwh and the word from a second person

If one day you have to donate a part of you to save the life of the one you want the most, then the free access to life you do by your will and through your word, ceases from being ready and willing, if, in real life, your own living Word speaks as if it was a second person saying: ‘In order for me to make this donation by which a life might be saved, …it will depend upon they delivering me, however, before it takes place …one of you will have to betray me… …let this cup pass from me…’.


Thin Measurement Line – All words originated from the ordinance named versio vulgata came from the same source of the Litanies of Iesu and were left to the gathering of Pergamus by certain angels.

The words 'let this cup pass from me' were measured, clearing up that they do not pertain to the words of Yhwh. Instruction was given about the precise extension of contents that can be measured: The altar and the temple which is also tabernacle and body of the lamb.

Get up and measure the Temple and the altar and those who operate in them,
Leave out the atrium of the court which is outside of the Temple
and do not measure it, for it was given to the nations.


The atrium of the court is every extension of content (in the bible) that is not about the Temple, the altar and those that operate in them.

When one leaves out the atrium, for it was given to the nations, the understanding is given that, in every extension of text (in the bible) which is not about the Temple and the altar, one does not need to measure (or search for precision) because those contents are found mixed and were left to the nations.
Posted by: harvest144

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 01/20/11 03:43 PM

Originally Posted By: Tamar Deburg
I'm curious....What does coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU?


Shalom Tamar,

To me, this means rejecting any & all human doctrines that are not completely supported by clear scriptural reasonings.

Then coming to an accurate knowledge, understanding & acceptance of the "clear light of scripture". (acceptance goes beyond knowledge & understanding, as satan & his demons know & understand, & yet rejected The Father)

Almost every "christian belief system" still contains some of the Roman beliefs that I believe we must divorce ourselves from, to gain our Heavenly Fathers approval.

H144

Posted by: yonah1

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 01/22/11 07:20 PM

The center piece of the Torah and the Ten Commandments revolves around the sanctity of Yahweh's name and the observance of His Sabbaths and Feast Days. From this everything else flows. And obviously this is what Babylon chooses to disregard - as they like Jews - put their own thoughts above those of Elohim and as a result - have never known the way of peace.

"The way of peace they know not; and there is no judgment in their goings: they have made them crooked paths: whosoever goeth therein shall not know peace." Isaiah 59:8

THE NAME THAT IS ABOVE EVERY NAME

"...It is time to bring the Church out of the Babylonian system and unite her in the truth. Since the time of the dark ages, the Church has struggled to free herself completely from the cords that entangled her and dimmed her light. The Spirit is once again calling for another step toward restoration. There will be those that will hear the voice of the Spirit that is crying, “Be not partakers of her sins...,” Revelations 18:4.

For every truth that has been revealed and accepted since the days of Martin Luther, there has been a great resistance and persecution. But restitution must come and with every wave of glory will come more persecution. Fear not, the fire is turned up to finish the refining process. The names Yahweh and Yasha have been rejected for years even by his people.

The removal of the names of the Father and his Son must be considered evil and a dishonor. It is one of the wrongs that must be set right just as the biblical feast and the Sabbath. And those who choose to participate will suffer for their stand. Listen to the words of Yasha,

“Then they will deliver you up to be afflicted, and will kill you; and you will be hated by all the nations for my name’s sake,” Matthew 24:9."


http://christthecreativeword.org/Messages/the_name_that_is_above_every_nam.htm

Why we use Yah and Yasha

http://www.eliyah.com/forum/messages/2254.html
Posted by: A_man_of_ELYON

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 01/25/11 03:28 PM



Just as the word staff means stick and persons (a body of assistants) at one time, even so the word stick was used before in ancient writings to represent people,

I will gather the stick of Jiusaff (House of Joseph), which is in the hand of Ephraim, and the sticks of the tribes of Ishrael his fellows, and I will gather them all together to the stick of Judah (House of Judah) and make them into One stick in *mine* gathered hands.


Now a word that isn’t unnusual: Baby, which the Four Sticks use not to represent people, because the following Baby is for those who hide their love to depths of life
and ruin dreams that we all knew so,


O Baby, I got to fly – because you know I got to get away from you Baby


The message about who is the Baby from whom the Four Sticks are getting away, was previously sung in Celebration Day,


her name is B’rown, A’white or B’lack, You know her very well
you can hear her cries of mercy as the winners toll the bell



Instead of coming out of her, many are heading to the opposite direction,


There’s a train that leaves the station heading for your destination
But the price you pay to nowhere has increased a dollar more
And if you walk you're gonna get there, tho' it takes a little longer,
And when you see it in the distance you will wring your hands and moan.



The poor ones who take a little longer to get there and the ones who do not take the train nor pay the price one pays to nowhere (tithes of salary), will not be there when Baby fall.


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Posted by: yonah1

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 01/26/11 09:21 AM

Since there is no "W" in Hebrew, and we claim to be getting back to "Hebraic Roots" why is a "W" substituted so often for "V" in "VAV" the 3rd letter of the Tetragrammaton? This obviously has serious implications for the correct pronunciation of Elohim's name.

"Special uses of Vav - The letter vav is used to mean "and" ("vav Hachibur" - the vav of connection). This Vav of connection is most often pronounced "Veh," but in certain cases (before a Shwa) it becomes "oo." This is often more honored in the breach than in the observance.

Vav has several types of sounds in Hebrew:ן Vav as a consonant is pronounced "V." This is most often at the beginning of a word where it may mean "and" as in גד ושרה (Gad and Sarah). As "V" it can also be sounded according to the vowel associated with it, Vah or Veh or Vee. But a Vav with an oo sound is not Voo.

Shuruk - When a dot is put in the Vav it becomes an "oo" sound. A Voo sound would require two vavs. This sound occurs frequently when Vav is used to mean "and" and is placed at the start of a word that has a shwa (semi silent or silent vowel) under the first letter. For example: חנה ובנותיה - Pronounced - "Hahnah oo'vnohtayeh, meaning Hanna and her sons...."


http://www.zionism-israel.com/hebrew/Hebrew_Alphabet_for_Dummies_6.htm


ANCIENT HEBREW OR PALAEO-HEBREW LETTER FORM OF THE NAME YOD-HAY-UAU-HAY .... In short, there is no letter "W" in Hebrew. To render the sixth letter of the ...
www.fossilizedcustoms.com/hebrew.html - Cached
Posted by: yonah1

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 01/27/11 08:15 AM

Monday, September 20, 2010
http://www.beawatchman.blogspot.com/

"His Name!"

"Why is it that we serve the Creator Elohim/God who is the Only real God yet Jews and Christians are the only religions who do not use His Name? All other religions use the name of their god to differentiate between their god and other gods. Instead we use a title. God, Lord, Savior, etc. These are all titles. That would be like me always being called mom, wife, sister, daughter but never by my name, Kathe. I could be anyone's mom, or wife, or sister or daughter. The title does not make me different, my name does.

In the original Holy Scriptures our Creator's Name was written over 6,000 times. Because of Jewish tradition those writings were changed to a title instead.(Remember the verses where the Bible tells us what is going to happen to those who change His Word?) Going through those Holy Scriptures and replacing His Name everywhere the Bible says GOD, LORD, Adonai, Elohim, etc. makes you realize that His Name was EVERYWHERE in Scripture. It also makes you realize the importance that He puts upon His Name and that it is very important to use His Name, both in reading His Word and in conversation with others. In fact we are told in His Word that those of us who use His Name in conversation will be blessed.

Yet most don't even know His Name. A few weeks ago I had a conversation with a believer. I said Yahweh and she looked at me funny. I told her that Yahweh is the Name of God and she was confused. She thought His Name was God. When I told her the bit about it being a title like her title was mom she was floored. She had been to church for years and was never told that.

This is a huge disservice to Yahweh. And to believers as well. His Word tells us that by His Name we are saved. It does not say by His title we are saved. Think about that one for a moment. You can argue all you want against it, I'm just saying what He is saying. Take it for what it's worth....."
Posted by: Carrol

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 01/27/11 08:51 PM

Coming out of Babylon mean to come out of the world's religious system. Most if not all of the Christians churches is a branch of ancient pagan religion. I have attended many of these churches, but now I do not. Man-made religion covers most of Christianity. Babylon is the world's church. If you are a child of Almighty Yahweh and you know you are not where you need to be. Come Out, Search the Sacred Scriptures, and Almighty Yahweh will guide you to where you need to be. Praise Almighty Yahweh
Posted by: yonah1

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 01/28/11 01:19 AM

Originally Posted By: Carrol
Babylon is the world's church. If you are a child of Almighty Yahweh and you know you are not where you need to be. Come Out, Search the Sacred Scriptures, and Almighty Yahweh will guide you to where you need to be.

Praise Almighty Yahweh



AMEIN! - 1Cor 10: 21 "You cannot drink the cup of Yahweh and the cup of demons; you cannot partake of the table of Yahweh and the table of demons."
Posted by: A_man_of_ELYON

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 01/28/11 08:33 AM

Originally Posted By: Carrol
Search the Sacred Scriptures, and Almighty Yahweh will guide you to where you need to be.





O.Fr. sacrer (12c.), from O.L. saceres, bind, restrict, enclose, protect.
L. secretus 'set apart, withdrawn, hidden,' originally pp. of secernere 'to set apart,' from se- 'without, apart,' prop. 'on one's own' (from PIE *sed-, from base *s(w)e-; see idiom) + cernere 'separate'.


The versio vulgata from which all mastercopies of bibles left to religion and doctrines were made
has kept secretus (treasure hidden as it is said in the parable);
If you go to the texts in the Hebrew bible, the word Emunah [Fidelity, fidelitate, consistency, firmness]
is to remain having fidelity to Yhwh's Word only.

When keeping emunah secretus the versio vulgata mistranslates emunah to fides quae creditur [belief that is credited by spirits of man]




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Posted by: ema

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 06/06/11 09:21 AM

Shalom -- (not my PC-no time to read it all -TY for Address:)

Thank you for
Main points <-clearly marked...

i was searching for Script re: "Eyes of Fire"
-^- These i see over the Capital ALB NY -knowing they are assoceated with the "ufo"...
-Paul/Shaul uses the word "Celestieal"
Having both the fascination & following "rebuke/ing" of them..
i seek pray/ers/ ...

Yest- YHWH having mercy on me- i was able to connect with a Prophet Right out of Scripture! --

William Dean http://wwfar.com/schd-mo.html
-The Keystone Treasure


^This was the first - i had a live conversation where another of mankind gave comprehension re: those morph-craft..

More importent [re Kingdom] Fear of YHWH -||- must hear^



If you have content re. these things;

pls. l o v (dot) t a p @ g m a i l (dot) c o m


Very greatfully,
ema Shulomet
Posted by: yeshuaslave

... - 09/16/11 02:34 PM

....
Posted by: MENZ

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 02/23/12 06:17 PM

Thank you for the good information that you have shared with us.

I have a question. I also believe America is Babylon, but does that also include Hawaii and Alaska, because Revelation 16:18 & 19, says Babylon is divided into three parts by an earthquake. Hawaii and Alaska are not connected to the 48 States.

In Jeremiah 50:23, says Babylon is "Broken". In Hebrew, the word "Broken" means... to burst, Break (down, off, IN PIECES...

Is Babylon just the 48 States? Hawaii was just recently added to America only about 60 years ago.

One of the reasons I ask this is because a family member, who is very sick, would not be given a passport to travel to another country because of his health condition.

Would going to Hawaii be coming out of Babylon?

I have heard that some of the people in Hawaii say that they are not part of the United States.

Thank you for your help!

Shalom,
In the Name Yah Yahshua
Posted by: yonah1

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 02/25/12 11:45 AM

Zeph 3:8 "I have decided to assemble the nations,
to gather the kingdoms
and to pour out my wrath on them—
all my fierce anger.
The whole world will be consumed
by the fire of my jealous anger."


That will include Alaska and Hawaii

And you can't get out of the world

1 Corinthians 5:9-10

So Babylon isn't just the US
Posted by: aaron bullock

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 03/19/12 07:44 AM

Need a place to go after leaving confusion.

I live in the mountain in Hawaii. I just pitch a tent and knock down trees for a garden I have 2 others here and we want to start a messianic communal living to study torah and observe feast days. Email me on Facebook
Aaron Scott bullock
Posted by: yonah1

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 10/08/12 02:59 AM




"....During Sukkot, every Jewish family by Torah is required to build a 3 sided booth for the festival to (if weather permits) live in or at least have a meal, a study or a time of prayer in there. It commemorates the 40 years that Israel wandered and camped in the desert. If one's life or health was at risk they were not required to stay in a sukkah and seeing as Miriam (Mary) being pregnant with Yasha (Jesus) Yosef (Joseph) sought out a hotel, and inn but to no avail.

Luke 2:6 And so it was, that, while they were there, the days were accomplished that she should be delivered. 7 And she brought forth her firstborn son, and wrapped him in swaddling clothes, and laid him in a manger; because there was no room for them in the inn.

And as fate would have it, they ended up in a sukkah of sorts anyway!...."

http://www.sarahstent.info/images/Merry_Sukkot.pdf

NOT A STABLE FOR UNCLEAN ANIMALS!

Posted by: overcoming

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 10/10/12 08:31 AM

Originally Posted By: Tamar Deburg
I'm curious....What does coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU?



For me, coming out of babylon means many things.

Primarily it means to come out of confusion brought on by false doctrine, lies believed, and opinions...mine and others, in every area of life.

Rev 18:2 And he cried with a mighty voice, saying, “Baḇel the great is fallen, is fallen, and has become a dwelling place of demons, a haunt for every unclean spirit, and a haunt for every unclean and hated bird,
Rev 18:3 because all the nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her whoring, and the sovereigns of the earth have committed whoring with her, and the merchants of the earth have become rich through the power of her riotous living.”
Rev 18:4 And I heard another voice from the heaven saying, “Come out of her, my people, lest you share in her sins, and lest you receive of her plagues.

To do so, one must be led by the Ruach Ha Kodesh, the spirit of truth. The narrow path few are on leads away from babylon.

Babylon is a mix of truth and error that leads astray. Catholicism, is the whore (false bride) the sovereigns of the earth commune with. The Denominations are demon nations and they are her 'daughters', offspring birthed in the protestant reformation. The christian church as we see it today is pure Nicolaitanism. The clergy has conquered the laity exactly as done in catholic churches.

When we believe false doctrines we are in babylon (confusion) and babylon is in us.

bâbel baw-bel'confusion;

bâlal baw-lal'A primitive root; to overflow (specifically with oil); by implication to mix; also to fodder: - anoint, confound, X fade, mingle, mix (self), give provender, temper.

If the time comes for me to need to know if a physical babylon is to be fled I am sure He will let me know. For now, it is about coming out of religion, the world and its ways, and taking into captivity all thoughts that oppose the Truth or clutter up my brilyunt egocentric mind. (sic) We are truly our own worst enemy.

It encompasses every aspect of daily life. Coming out of babylon partly means rejection of TV, most music, books, websites, processed foods, politics, medicine and even people. It takes a long time to come out...many years.

He that hath an ear, let them hear what the Ruach Ha Kodesh is saying. Keep the focus on overcoming the sins that easily beset you while studying to show yourself approved to Elohim as a workmen that does not need to be ashamed, RIGHTLY DIVIDING THE WORDS OF TRUTH.

Rome, America, Christianity...its all a distraction from what really matters. Wisdom says come out of babylon, in part, by no longer babbling-on with topics and information that are not practical, too lofty/wordy and not germaine to our personal, daily walk. Pro 10:19 When words are many, Transgression is not absent, But he who restrains his lips is wise.

To come out of babylon one must be aware of the adversarys schemes and activities. It is necessary for us to understand what demons are, what they do and how they do it. This knowledge comes from above and is only valid/effective when learned directly from the Ruach. Eph 6:12 Because we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against authorities, against the world-rulers of the darkness of this age, against spiritual matters of wickedness in the heavenlies.

Heb 5:9 And having been perfected, He became the Causer of everlasting deliverance to all those obeying Him,
Heb 5:10 having been designated by Elohim a High Priest “according to the order of Malkitseḏeq,”
Heb 5:11 concerning whom we have much to say, and hard to explain, since you have become dull of hearing.
Heb 5:12 For indeed, although by this time you ought to be teachers, you need someone to teach you again the first elements of the Words of Elohim. And you have become such as need milk and not solid food.
Heb 5:13 For everyone partaking of milk is inexperienced in the word of righteousness, for he is a babe.
Heb 5:14 But solid food is for the mature whose senses have been trained by practice to discern both good and evil.


Ask, pray, fast, for the anointing mentioned in the following scripture...DO NOT ASSUME YOU ALREADY HAVE IT.

1Jn 2:25 And this is the promise that He has promised us: everlasting life.
1Jn 2:26 I have written this to you concerning those who lead you astray.
1Jn 2:27 But the anointing which you have received from Him stays in you, and you have no need that anyone should teach you. But as the same anointing does teach you concerning all, and is true, and is no falsehood, and even as it has taught you, you stay in Him.
1Jn 2:28 And now, little children, stay in Him, so that when He appears, we might have boldness and not be ashamed before Him at His coming.

May we never think too highly of ourselves. Not one shred of truth comes from my deaf ears, blind eyes, wicked heart, untameable tongue or carnal mind (brain).

Every fiber of our being needs to be locked on to the desire for YHVH Elohim to work out His will in our lives.

We must stay repentant and humble as we embrace with obediance His Torah along with faith in Yahshua our precious messiah.

Time is short, the tribulation will begin soon.

No spots, no wrinkles. Return to your first love.
Posted by: Tony

Out of Babylon, keep torah, politically incorrect - 01/14/13 12:44 AM

The mark of the beast (Rev 13:17) might not be a new technological invention. The economies of this country and every country rely on debt, see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_public_debt. The system of debt is based on trusting for repayment. That trust competes with faith in Yahweh, and marks us with the beast's mark. If we're not satisfied with food and clothing (per 1 Tim 6:8), we will produce a taxable income (or taxable bartering), rely on credit cards, receive welfare (such as social security, which is a transfer of wealth from whoever currently pays into it), have a checking account (which is subject to the whims of the federal reserve and the IRS).

The basis of the financial system is trusting in the beast's system, so don’t bank on it.
You shall make no covenant with the inhabitants of the land. Judges 2:2
Do not be unequally yoked with unbelievers. 2 Cor 6:14
Do not submit again to a yoke of slavery. Gal 5:1

The mark is a covenant we enter through our signature, our conversation, by stating our SSN, by having insurance, by registration (of our car, our marriage). The mark is forbidden in Exodus: Take care, lest you make a covenant with the inhabitants of the land to which you go, lest it become a snare in your midst. . . . lest you make a covenant with the inhabitants of the land, and when they whore after their gods and sacrifice. Exd 34:12, 15.

The mark gives us power for taking dominion, through the flesh: "To you I will give all this authority and their glory, for it has been delivered to me, and I give it to whom I will. If you, then, will worship me, it will all be yours." Luke 4:6-7

The mark is a submission to the language and rules of the beast's court system, in opposition to the courts of heaven. Man's courts use language that is technical and deceptive. If you're in their court, don't answer (as Yahshua didn't answer in Mat 27:14) but cry out in prayer and praise to Yahweh with uplifted hands. They'll think we're crazy though they're crazy. No jury duty, no will, no advanced directive, no voting, no lawyers. Don't use their courts to stand up for your rights, per Romans 12:19: Beloved, never avenge yourselves, but leave it to the wrath of Yahweh, for it is written, "Vengeance is mine, I will repay, says the Lord." Surnames aren't used in the bible, so let's maintain a biblical mindset -- without surnames. Pray for those who abuse us, that Yahweh forgives them. Destroy your documents. Change your place of residence.

The mark helps us do the ministry of the church, through the flesh: On that day many will say to me, 'Master, Master, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?' And then will I declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.' Mat 7:22-23

The result of taking the beast's mark could include Yahweh's personal visitation: I will visit you with panic, with wasting disease and fever that consume the eyes and make the heart ache. Lev 26:14-16

Best is not to receive mail (which is based on the government's hand-out) or have an official address. Learn to prosper without buying or selling. The night-time is when no man can work (John 9:4), and the night-time began how many centuries ago? Are any churches not run by wolves?

Find a way to be a Resident Volunteer, who can pay it forward to your employer (try http://helpx.net, http://www.workaway.info, share cropping, http://growfood.org). Try off the grid. Don’t establish your political/financial sovereignty that is tied to the world’s system. Only request room and board. There's no better nation than wherever you're living.

Every blessing from the state prevents Yahweh's blessing, because the state's blessing has strings attached -- attaching us to the beast. The courts of heaven are continually taking notice. I only want Yahweh's mark: They will see his face, and his name will be on their foreheads. Rev 22:4 By following our conscience in our need, we have an opportunity to call on the name of Yahweh for deliverance.

About Babylon:
http://www.escapeallthesethings.com/america-mystery-babylon-great.htm
http://endoftheage.blogspot.com/search/label/Babylon

see:
http://www.yahskingdom.com/whatistandfor.html
http://www.yahskingdom.com/pdf/mark.pdf
Posted by: leejosepho

Re: Out of Babylon, keep torah, politically incorrect - 01/14/13 10:27 AM

Originally Posted By: Tony
The mark of the beast (Rev 13:17) might not be a new technological invention...

The basis of...trusting in the beast's system...
You shall make no covenant with the inhabitants of the land. Judges 2:2
Do not be unequally yoked with unbelievers. 2 Cor 6:14
Do not submit again to a yoke of slavery. Gal 5:1

... Take care, lest you make a covenant with the inhabitants of the land to which you go, lest it become a snare in your midst. . . . lest you make a covenant with the inhabitants of the land, and when they whore after their gods and sacrifice. Exd 34:12, 15.

I think that covers the matter fairly well. This world has its various political, economic and religious systems, and we each-and-all have an individual-together choice to make (as we have been called to bear witness of Yahuah to this world):

1) Shall we gratefully (or even otherwise) submit/respond to the Sovereign Monarch who has "called us out of 'Egypt'";
-or-
2) Shall we indulge in delusional-and-seeming self-governance, self-sufficiency and their accompanying self-worship?

Living that out is yet another challenge. In days past, I have refused to place my hand on the glass (fancy time clock) in order to have employment, I have refused to make purchases via a bar-code scanner, I have refused to use certain currencies and coins, I have refused to remove my glasses for a photo at the License Bureau in order to get a driver's license by first letting them use facial recognition technology to be sure I am really me and have no other ID...and so on and on.

Quote:
If we're not satisfied with food and clothing (per 1 Tim 6:8)...

If it were not for my having recently applied for SSDI, I would today possibly be starving in the street...if not already dead.

I have yet to sort that out.








Posted by: yonah1

Re: Out of Babylon, keep torah, politically incorrect - 01/14/13 11:03 AM

Originally Posted By: leejosepho


Quote:
If we're not satisfied with food and clothing (per 1 Tim 6:8)...

If it were not for my having recently applied for SSDI, I would today possibly be starving in the street...if not already dead.

I have yet to sort that out.
amein
Posted by: Jauhuchanam

Re: Out of Babylon, keep torah, politically incorrect - 01/14/13 10:13 PM

Originally Posted By: leejosepho
Quote:
If we're not satisfied with food and clothing (per 1 Tim 6:8)...

If it were not for my having recently applied for SSDI, I would today possibly be starving in the street...if not already dead.

I have yet to sort that out.


I do not know what 'SSDI' in the usa is (sounds like "SS-Division Intelligence" for me as a German speaking native) but

Originally Posted By: leejosepho
I would today possibly be starving in the street...if not already dead.

is quiet shocking to me to hear!

A little time ago I offered for brethern in need a helping hand, so to speak.
I would send money to Eliyah (Tom as he is called by his civil name, I heard recently)
to supply it to brothers and sisters in need.
Feel free to name what your requirements are.
I do what I can.
What are all those thousands of words or those thousands of conceited "wisdom" and "knowledge"
and not having AGAPE ?


You can also e-mail me if you prefer: georgloeding@gmail.com

Be blessed
Posted by: yonah1

Re: Out of Babylon, keep torah, politically incorrect - 01/14/13 10:59 PM

Originally Posted By: Jauhuchanam
I do not know what 'SSDI' in the usa is (sounds like "SS-Division Intelligence" for me as a German speaking native) but


In the US Social Security Retirement Income begins at 62 years but then is increased at 65 known as SSDI or Disability Income, since you are considered disabled at 65 for which a person is eligible if they can't work at earlier ages due various factors. The politicians love to play football with this and threaten to take it away from sick and elderly, along with government medical programs for which people have been paying into all their working lives, instead of ceasing to fund wars and other useless government "pork", as it's called. But they don't have a problem voting themselves regular pay and benefit increases. Took me 50 years to figure out that the politicians are government employees, so naturally they normally vote for the will of their cronies and themselves. There are about 97% of them that are incompetent or outright crooks. Ruins it for the other 3%. Takes me a while to catch on some times.
Posted by: leejosepho

Re: Out of Babylon, keep torah, politically incorrect - 01/15/13 09:46 AM

Originally Posted By: Jauhuchanam
Originally Posted By: leejosepho
Quote:
If we're not satisfied with food and clothing (per 1 Tim 6:8)...

If it were not for my having recently applied for SSDI, I would today possibly be starving in the street...if not already dead.

I have yet to sort that out.


I do not know what 'SSDI' in the usa is (sounds like "SS-Division Intelligence" for me as a German speaking native) but

Originally Posted By: leejosepho
I would today possibly be starving in the street...if not already dead.

is quiet shocking to me to hear!

A little time ago I offered for brethrern in need a helping hand, so to speak.
I would send money to Eliyah (Tom as he is called by his civil name, I heard recently)
to supply it to brothers and sisters in need.
Feel free to name what your requirements are.
I do what I can.
What are all those thousands of words or those thousands of conceited "wisdom" and "knowledge"
and not having AGAPE ?


You can also e-mail me if you prefer: georgloeding@gmail.com

Be blessed

I thank you very much for your willingness to be blessed by being a blessing! Many folks (as in my own past ignorance) merely "pray for others" without ever offering to actually *do* anything that might actually help (as a vessel) in bringing about some actual provision.

All is well here with my dear wife and me, yet it grieves me that much of our provision comes from the pockets of others after it has been forcibly-extracted by "the powers that be" here in this particular land where we happen to reside.

Many years ago, I had once (and actually, defiantly) remarked that I had come into this world with nothing and that I would leave it the same way while proving I had to accumulate nothing along the way in order to live out my later years. I am far from proud of that statement today, and yet here I sit in that very situation, precisely.

I had learned this as a child:
==============================
He owns the cattle on a thousand hills,
The wealth in every mine;
He owns the rivers and the rocks and rills,
The sun and stars that shine.
Wonderful riches, more than tongue can tell -
He is my Father so they're mine as well;
He owns the cattle on a thousand hills -
I know that He will care for me.
===============================

I do not consider anything I have to be "mine", and I freely give to others at every right opportunity. Nevertheless, and as I have shared, I do not know how to sort this (as follows) in relation to my understanding or misunderstanding of that little song:

"...much of our provision comes from the pockets of others after it has been forcibly-extracted by 'the powers that be' here in this particular land where we happen to reside."

There is no need for me to be critical of the brethren or to chastise even myself, yet I do believe we might all some day have to account for that.

Rhetorically: Shall we be known by our love for one another...or will we not?
Posted by: leejosepho

Re: Out of Babylon, keep torah, politically incorrect - 01/15/13 10:14 AM

Originally Posted By: yonah1
In the US Social Security Retirement Income begins at 62 years but then is increased at 65 known as SSDI or Disability Income, since you are considered disabled at 65 for which a person is eligible if they can't work at earlier ages due various factors.

Ah, I just learned a bit there. I had applied for SSDI at 60, then it took until 62 to eventually "win an appeal" and begin receiving it retroactively.

Quote:
The politicians love to play football with this and threaten to take it away... But they don't have a problem voting themselves regular pay and benefit increases... Takes me a while to catch on some times.

Same here, and yet I recently "got a raise" myself.

Overall, however, I think this is a place where few (if even any) of us have any right or obligation to hold a grip on a stone.
Posted by: yeshuaslave

Re: Out of Babylon, keep torah, politically incorrect - 01/22/13 09:00 AM


did/were the israelites upset that the egyptians gave them quite a lot of gold and silver AS YAHWEH ORDERED.
??
yes, however, there IS A COMPLETE DIFFERENCE IN YAHUSHUA !
..
the apostles wore threadbare clothes at times, and rejoiced to give the good news for free, without charge.
like their master, they often 'has no place to lay their head',
like their master, they often were beaten, with whips.
.
like their master, they often were imprisoned, for the sake of the good news. for preaching about JESUS! (not about torah).
.
like their master, disciples today go through the same treatment all over the globe.
.
even in the united states.
.
.
.
all over the globe, the believers who have given up their lives for the good news sake (delivering salvation to all who will receive it),
live in union with abba, in yahushua(Jesus), with one another, joyfully laying down their lives for one another and almost never in the news, nor even on the internet.




Originally Posted By: leejosepho
Originally Posted By: Jauhuchanam
Originally Posted By: leejosepho
Quote:
If we're not satisfied with food and clothing (per 1 Tim 6:8)...

If it were not for my having recently applied for SSDI, I would today possibly be starving in the street...if not already dead.

I have yet to sort that out.


I do not know what 'SSDI' in the usa is (sounds like "SS-Division Intelligence" for me as a German speaking native) but

Originally Posted By: leejosepho
I would today possibly be starving in the street...if not already dead.

is quiet shocking to me to hear!
...
What are all those thousands of words or those thousands of conceited "wisdom" and "knowledge"
and not having AGAPE ?


You can also e-mail me if you prefer: georgloeding@gmail.com

Be blessed

I thank you very much for your willingness to be blessed by being a blessing! Many folks (as in my own past ignorance) merely "pray for others" without ever offering to actually *do* anything that might actually help (as a vessel) in bringing about some actual provision.

All is well here with my dear wife and me, yet it grieves me that much of our provision comes from the pockets of others after it has been forcibly-extracted by "the powers that be" here in this particular land where we happen to reside.

Many years ago, I had once (and actually, defiantly) remarked that I had come into this world with nothing and that I would leave it the same way while proving I had to accumulate nothing along the way in order to live out my later years. I am far from proud of that statement today, and yet here I sit in that very situation, precisely.

I had learned this as a child:
==============================
He owns the cattle on a thousand hills,
The wealth in every mine;
He owns the rivers and the rocks and rills,
The sun and stars that shine.
Wonderful riches, more than tongue can tell -
He is my Father so they're mine as well;
He owns the cattle on a thousand hills -
I know that He will care for me.
===============================

I do not consider anything I have to be "mine", and I freely give to others at every right opportunity. Nevertheless, and as I have shared, I do not know how to sort this (as follows) in relation to my understanding or misunderstanding of that little song:

"...much of our provision comes from the pockets of others after it has been forcibly-extracted by 'the powers that be' here in this particular land where we happen to reside."

There is no need for me to be critical of the brethren or to chastise even myself, yet I do believe we might all some day have to account for that.

Rhetorically: Shall we be known by our love for one another...or will we not?
Posted by: nazarite777

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 02/15/13 10:17 AM

shalom Tamar,

"Coming out of Babylon" is often used in the context of Rev 18:4

"And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues."

this VERY closely resounds as it was written of old when referring to the literal kingdom of Chaldee by the Prophets. and our literal coming out of Babylon with the lead of Ezra and Z'rubavel.

Isaiah 48:20 Leave Babylon, flee from the Babylonians! Announce this with shouts of joy and proclaim it. Send it out to the ends of the earth; say, "The LORD has redeemed his servant Jacob."

Isaiah 52:11 Depart, depart, go out from there! Touch no unclean thing! Come out from it and be pure, you who carry the vessels of the LORD.

Jeremiah 50:8 "Flee out of Babylon; leave the land of the Babylonians, and be like the goats that lead the flock.

Jeremiah 51:6 "Flee from Babylon! Run for your lives! Do not be destroyed because of her sins. It is time for the LORD's vengeance; he will pay her what she deserves.

Jeremiah 51:9 "'We would have healed Babylon, but she cannot be healed; let us leave her and each go to his own land, for her judgment reaches to the skies, it rises as high as the clouds.'

Jeremiah 51:45 "Come out of her, my people! Run for your lives! Run from the fierce anger of the LORD.

Nehemiah 8:17 And all the congregation of them that were come again out of the captivity made booths, and sat under the booths: for since the days of Jeshua the son of Nun unto that day had not the children of Israel done so. And there was very great gladness.

This likening of "mystery Babylon" to the kingdom of the Chaldean was not without cause. the Revelator John foretold of a great apostasy within the kingdom and this harlot church is represented by Mystery Babylon as it occupies The kingdom after it grows to such a great influence as it has today. we are told to "come out of her" Just as we were once told we would leave Babylon of Nebuchadnezzar. also in similar fashion a we left Egypt.

But "Coming out of Babylon" though it is a very long processes and can take longer for some then others , it is still NOT our final goal!

After we "come out" we will find our selves Alone. As did the Israelites coming out of Egypt. Likewise Ezra led us out of Babylon and found little more then Ruins awaiting him in Canaan.

Often when we are coming out we meet others in the wilderness who are also "coming out of Babylon". This can be a confirmation we are on the right path but, at times the temptation is to settle together after we find each other in such a vast wilderness is present. But this could be likened to the grumbling against Moses and desire to remain outside of the Land of Promise. much like remaining in Babylon, Settling in the wilderness is also rebellion against the most Highs Kingdom. we are to Rebel against this Babylonian kingdom but submit to YaH's kingdom, His Halakhah is unchanging!

We ought to Continue our Journey together after a wilderness meeting. not stopping and making any settlements till we find the true Israel of YaH. Before crossing the Jordan the men were circumcised.Then after we crossed the border there was much kingdom building to be done. Likewise Ezra had to also Build much after he "came out of Babylon" leaving that place simply was not and still is not the end goal! It is simply the first step!

Often I encounter People who believe themselves to "Have the whole truth" yet they are still unaware of what title to give them selves, often settling on very generic terms like "Torah Keeper" or "Torah observant disciple of Yeshua" ..while these titles are accurate and have no error in them. they are not proper nouns! nor are they historically the title given to believers in Messiah. I mention this only as a reference point. In all reality it matters not what we are called. It is however difficult to imagine that a person has "found the complete truth" when they are still unaware of the title given to the "sect" or community created by Rabbi Yeshua whom they claim to follow! If this Is you or someone you love I do not condemn but merely point to a basic observation! we are all being taught Daily we must be sure we are able to continue to receive instruction and correction. not being so certain we already have it all that we will not hear something that seems contrary to our current doctrine. Remembering how corrupt our doctrine once was when we were in Babylon. We can"come out of Babylon" much easier then we can "enter in to covenant". Let us be sure not to die in the wilderness but rather let us Cross the Jordan into the land of the covenant!

May all of Israel come out of Babylon and enter into the kingdom. may the vineyard be restored and the works of the adversary be destroyed.

Mercy, Love, and Peace multiplied to You and your Home!
Posted by: leejosepho

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 02/15/13 01:01 PM

Originally Posted By: nazarite777
"Coming out of Babylon" ... is still NOT our final goal!

After we "come out" we will find our selves alone ...

... we meet others in the wilderness who are also "coming out of Babylon" ...

... at times the temptation is to settle together after we find each other ...

We ought to Continue our Journey together after a wilderness meeting.

Yes, and I find myself still "dropping baggage" along the way.

Salvation awaits us who endure to the end, and we will never get there if we have already "arrived".

Someone once complained there seemed to always be yet another hill to climb, but we chose (accepted) our path for its destination and not by the depth of the rut.

Shalom
Posted by: Yochy

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 05/26/13 02:36 PM

In response to a link on one of the replies:

One of our Sisters wrote that the true Israelites were the Anglo-Saxons. Others replied that they thought the Africans and the Latinos were the true Israelites.

This is my reply, what are your thoughts on this strange take on the Israelite identity.

(How come the Jews we have in Israel today are the only ones who have been the keepers of the scriptures, not the African blacks or the Latinos and not even the Anglo Saxons. There is nothing within these cultures that even slightly hints at anything within the Tanakh being passed down through history to these people groups, they are so far from Torah historically, Anglo Saxons do not come from the line of Shem, as they are not Semites, they come from the line of Yapheth.
For the last 2,500 - 3,000 yrs we have historical writings out side of scripture which confirm the identity of the Jewish people. With a little searching and reading of scripture and historical writings this confusion can easily be cleared up).

Or could the Aborigines be the lost tribe, or maybe the Eskimos?

All meant in good fun and smile.
Posted by: Yochy

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 05/27/13 06:36 AM

Coming out of Babylon, well what did it mean to the Jews of the time, the early followers?
I believe we have to try to understand what it meant when it was being taught then, not to us 2,000 years later. Scripture if I am correct only states that the gentiles have a time period ( time of the gentiles, not the time of the church), then it is the time of Jacobs troubles. The time of the gentiles, has it ended?, with Israel being made a state in a day, who would have thought it.
Are we now in Jacobs troubles, if we are?, does that mean gentiles need to repent turn to YHWH, be immersed, ( turn from there sin and the ways of this world),before the time of the gentiles is over ( to come out of Babylon ).
Surely Abba, has a cutting of point?, before he turns His attentions back on Israel?.
Posted by: leejosepho

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 05/27/13 07:08 AM

Originally Posted By: Yochy
Coming out of Babylon, well what did it mean to the Jews of the time, the early followers?
I believe we have to try to understand what it meant when it was being taught then, not to us 2,000 years later.

I tend to agree in the sense that all things today are not just about us, and we live in a world where its overall state seems worse now than ever before.

Quote:
Scripture if I am correct only states that the gentiles have a time period ( time of the gentiles, not the time of the church), then it is the time of Jacobs troubles. The time of the gentiles, has it ended?

Twenty years have now passed since I was told by a fellow believer that the door for the Gentiles has been closed, and today I do not see or hear anyone even trying to get to it.

Quote:
Surely Abba, has a cutting of point?, before he turns His attentions back on Israel?.

I would be interesting in hearing what you mean by "turns His attentions back".
Posted by: Yochy

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 05/27/13 12:40 PM

[
Quote:
Surely Abba, has a cutting of point?, before he turns His attentions back on Israel?.

I would be interesting in hearing what you mean by "turns His attentions back". [/quote]

Shalom Joseph

Israel has a temporary Vail over her, future prophecies have to come about, 144 virgins, wars/war on Israel, return of Mashiach, etc.
The rapture as such, is it for the Church?, seeing as Abba says nothing in scripture with regards to starting a new religion called Christianity ( Yeshua, Kefa, Sh'ual were not Christians), the prophecies were and are for Israel and the world/nations who wish to be grafted into the covenant with YHWH.
Hence Abba, once His time clock for the gentiles has stopped/finished, He will then turn His attentions fully back to Israel?, not that He ever fully left her.

We are but invited to join Israel, to turn from our sins/repent, be immersed, and live a life in accordance to YHWH Torah, all through the blood of the Lamb, Amien.

Coming out of Babylon?
Posted by: leejosepho

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 05/27/13 05:29 PM

Shalom Yochy

Originally Posted By: Yochy
Abba says nothing in scripture with regards to starting a new religion called Christianity (Yeshua, Kefa, Sh'ual were not Christians), the prophecies were and are for Israel and the world/nations who wish to be grafted into the covenant with YHWH.

That is something I began learning a little over twenty years ago, and the only thing I am not sure about along that line today is whether I have been grafted in or called back and restored or whatever! But either way, yes, Abba has only one people...and they/we have yet to ever be replaced (even temporarily) as I used to believe and claim. And as an aside here: I have heard the term/label "Christian" is a slur first spoken by others while mocking the "taught ones" who never called themselves anything other than possibly something like "a follower of the Son of the Living Elohim"...and that is about the only "label" I ever place upon myself whenever anyone might ask (such as when someone might wonder whether I might be a "Christian").

Quote:
Hence Abba, once His time clock for the gentiles has stopped/finished, He will then turn His attentions fully back to Israel?, not that He ever fully left her.

Allowing for differences in perceptions, I thank you for the clarification!
Posted by: Yochy

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 05/28/13 04:08 PM

Originally Posted By: leejosepho
Shalom Yochy

Originally Posted By: Yochy
Abba says nothing in scripture with regards to starting a new religion called Christianity (Yeshua, Kefa, Sh'ual were not Christians), the prophecies were and are for Israel and the world/nations who wish to be grafted into the covenant with YHWH.

That is something I began learning a little over twenty years ago, and the only thing I am not sure about along that line today is whether I have been grafted in or called back and restored or whatever! But either way, yes, Abba has only one people...and they/we have yet to ever be replaced (even temporarily) as I used to believe and claim. And as an aside here: I have heard the term/label "Christian" is a slur first spoken by others while mocking the "taught ones" who never called themselves anything other than possibly something like "a follower of the Son of the Living Elohim"...and that is about the only "label" I ever place upon myself whenever anyone might ask (such as when someone might wonder whether I might be a "Christian").

Quote:
Hence Abba, once His time clock for the gentiles has stopped/finished, He will then turn His attentions fully back to Israel?, not that He ever fully left her.

Allowing for differences in perceptions, I thank you for the clarification!


Hi Joseph

Grafted in, called back, restored ?, not sure? but I know He is calling His children to return, go back to, follow His commands/way, teachings, guidance?.
Those who have ears smile
I am not to sure how long this move back to the original understanding of His message/mystery smile has been going on with the gentiles, I mean in modern times, maybe the last 150 yrs?

But it seems to be the biggest move/change in the body in these times. He is telling those that want to hear, get out of her, and return to Me/Him.

I was once told, Christian was a Roman insult to believers in Christ, Christians meaning little Christs?

Jews see you as Christian, Christians see you as a Jewdaisa :), neither group agrees with you, can't win either way.

You guys over the pond are lucky, we do not have many if any places to go and meet other believers. UK is still a Catholic/Pros country. There are Messianic groups in London and large towns. Costs a lot in fuel to get about here, so Internet is a good tool for us.
Posted by: leejosepho

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 05/28/13 06:45 PM

Originally Posted By: Yochy
Jews see you as Christian, Christians see you as a Jewdaisa :), neither group agrees with you, can't win either way.

Oh the irony, eh?! Two things I have learned there:

1) Never criticize, argue or lecture;
2) Agree with everything you possibly can.

One of my neatest experiences ever was when two young men had come to my door and one was obviously a trainee. As the other spoke, I agreed wherever I possibly could, then shared a bit of personal experience (witness) and slipped in a thought-provoking question or two...and before long, the younger man had begun asking questions of his own and the older wanted to leave! I have no idea who or what they thought I was, but I do know who and what was on their minds when they left.

Quote:
You guys over the pond are lucky, we do not have many if any places to go and meet other believers.

I am not aware of any near me, but that does not mean I am sure there are none...and my wife and I am now 900 miles away from my daughters, grandchildren and others with whom we have fellowshipped for many years. So yes, online has become a lifeline of sorts.

Shalom
Posted by: Yochy

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 05/29/13 04:34 PM

Originally Posted By: leejosepho
Originally Posted By: Yochy
Jews see you as Christian, Christians see you as a Jewdaisa :), neither group agrees with you, can't win either way.

Oh the irony, eh?! Two things I have learned there:

1) Never criticize, argue or lecture;
2) Agree with everything you possibly can.

One of my neatest experiences ever was when two young men had come to my door and one was obviously a trainee. As the other spoke, I agreed wherever I possibly could, then shared a bit of personal experience (witness) and slipped in a thought-provoking question or two...and before long, the younger man had begun asking questions of his own and the older wanted to leave! I have no idea who or what they thought I was, but I do know who and what was on their minds when they left.

Quote:
You guys over the pond are lucky, we do not have many if any places to go and meet other believers.

I am not aware of any near me, but that does not mean I am sure there are none...and my wife and I am now 900 miles away from my daughters, grandchildren and others with whom we have fellowshipped for many years. So yes, online has become a lifeline of sorts.

Shalom


There was me thinking I was a long way from like minded brothers and sisters smile.
Having the inter-net is good in that way. I think what I was trying to say, is the traditional Christian understanding of the Scriptures is the norm here.
Although Torah understanding and Shauls teachings are slowly being presented in the way the first followers would have understood them.
You are right about slipping in a thought provoking question, I was having a conversation with a guy at work about smells ( I know a riveting/intellectual chat smile ). Kind of went like this, why do bad things smell bad and good things smell good, a carcass smells really bad but a strawberry smells great, how do fragrance's evolve?, he thought about it then laughed, so I said as someone who does not believe there is a G-d how come you think you have a soul.
Made him think I think.

Point no 2, I do that with my wife. I try to do no 1, but that seems to fail some times :), which then leads to point no 2.
Posted by: leejosepho

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 05/29/13 06:26 PM

I had not thought about fragrances, aromas, odors and such, but yes, even the most-repulsive odors are good since they let us know something bad is nearby or "in the air" or whatever. And of course, the same is true with pain being a "touchstone of reality" letting us known when even our own lives are in need of attention.

One of my favorite discussions with others is about the word "good". For example: Some of us like to call ice cream "good", but it is not. It is tasty and we might enjoy eating it, but two of the "best" (as I thought at the time) chili dogs I ever had once tipped the scale and landed me on a gurney in an ER while suffering a heart attack. After a nurse had asked me what I had just eaten, that word "good" soon began doing flip-flops in my mind...and today I no longer declare anything "good" unless Abba-Father had first done so and let us know.
Posted by: Yochy

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 06/02/13 02:36 PM

Hi Joseph,
I was explaining to him that if everything has evolved over a long period of time, how do things get there smells and more to the point these things have smells that match there appearance.
Is that random chance?, also i asked him if he thought he had a soul?, he said yes of course, so i said how can you have a soul if you do not believe in anything spiritual, it made him think smile
Also made me think, when you speak to most people, people who do not believe, they do believe that they will go to some kind of heaven. Then when i explain that the Christian concept of heaven is not what the scriptures show us, they get defencive. What are your thoughts on that ie when we die we go to heaven and will be with loved ones extra?.
Shalom John.
Hope you and your family had a restful and blessed Shabbat.
Posted by: leejosepho

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 06/02/13 03:40 PM

Originally Posted By: Yochy
Hope you and your family had a restful and blessed Shabbat.

Yes, for the most part, then late yesterday evening we got a small taste of the kind of storms that have devastated part of Oklahoma over these past couple of weeks and not far from us. I shy away from thoughts of that kind of thing being some kind of specific punishment being meted out, but our being completely engulfed by heavy winds, thunder, lightning and rain for a while last night surely did remind me that even the rocks can be caused to cry out, if ever necessary.

Quote:
...most people, people who do not believe, they do believe that they will go to some kind of heaven. Then when i explain that the Christian concept of heaven is not what the scriptures show us, they get defencive.

Yes, and I find that interesting. Their personal philosophies or whatever are dependent upon certain arguments against traditional pulpit teachings, and agreeing with them wherever possible can sometimes cause them a bit of discomfort when they discover they might have to re-think things a bit.

Quote:
What are your thoughts on that ie when we die we go to heaven and will be with loved ones extra?

That kind of teaching sure helps sell sentimental gospel recordings, eh?! But really, I do not know what to think about all of that. I suspect the JWs might be closest to correct when they speak of our inhabiting a new earth, and that certainly sounds to me like a great place for the new Jerusalem as well as for the lion and lamb to lie side-by-side. But I think the kind of looking around I used to do while still being churched many years ago will likely never even come to mind during whatever kind of "great reunion in the sky" we might have.
Posted by: Yochy

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 06/05/13 02:25 PM

Hi Joseph

I have seen on the news that you guys have had some really bad weather, do you feel that Abba may be showing the leaders of US He is not happy with there lack of support with Israel?, those who bless you, those whose curse you?

I find it hard to make people see that nothing about scripture has changed from Yeshuas time even if we have had 1500 yrs of Catholic theology, which is what most traditional churches still teach within the core of there understanding. It is that core belief that the Torah ( Law) was fulfilled by Jesus and they have it written on there hearts. If only they would take the time to understand the Hebrew understanding of it all, they would be amazed as I am sure you and I were.

Yes I agree the JWs seem to have one thing right Heaven and Earth as one?, do you see things as a lot of our brothers do as this is the time of the end?, Israel being made a nation in one day and all the other things that a lot of scholars are pointing to end time prof?.
Did you see on your news the two black Muslims over here who stabbed and tried to hack the head off of one of our soldiers? One of the out comes to this is that the government here is going to crack down on people with extremist view points on issues, such as religion, politics etc. Could we read into that as meaning people with our view point on the scriptures?, could this be a build up to a greater intolerance to G-ds word?.

Shalom for now brother smile
Posted by: leejosepho

Re: What does....Coming out of Babylon mean to....YOU - 06/06/13 07:03 AM

Shalom, Yocky.

Originally Posted By: Yochy
I have seen on the news that you guys have had some really bad weather, do you feel that Abba may be showing the leaders of US He is not happy with there lack of support with Israel?, those who bless you, those whose curse you?

Not unless those disaster-stricken folks in Oklahoma are somehow responsible for international policies.

Quote:
I find it hard to make people see that nothing about scripture has changed from Yeshuas time...

I first began learning that from a Zola Levitt book entitled "The Bible [YahuShua] Read". We agree with Him when we agree with Moshe and the prophets.

Quote:
do you see things as a lot of our brothers do as this is the time of the end?, Israel being made a nation in one day and all the other things that a lot of scholars are pointing to end time prof?.

I first heard the word "eschatology" in about 1963, and it fascinated me at the time to hear someone put everything together sequentially and speak of a logical "next" seeming to be forthcoming. But since "any day now" could easily also mean any of the next several millenniums, I typically just listen whenever people speak of these things.


Quote:
the government here is going to crack down on people with extremist view points on issues, such as religion, politics etc. Could we read into that as meaning people with our view point on the scriptures?, could this be a build up to a greater intolerance to G-ds word?.

I would tend to doubt that. It is easier to silence a prophet by reducing or even completely removing his or her audience than to get one to stop talking at all. Nevertheless, yes, we already know anyone who does not act liked a pluralist is considered a terrorist:

--------------------
From: "President Declares 'Freedom at War with Fear'"
Office of the Press Secretary, September 20, 2001
Address to a Joint Session of Congress and the American People
United States Capitol, Washington, D.C., 9:00 P.M. EDT

THE PRESIDENT:
... Every nation, in every region, now has a decision to make: Either you are with us* [who believe in progress and pluralism, tolerance and freedom], or you are with the terrorists. (Applause.)
... the fight of *all who believe in progress and pluralism, tolerance and freedom.
...
Thank you. (Applause.)
END 9:41 P.M. EDT
--------------------